The Seahawks and great edge rushers are having such a hard time finding one another that the other day I overheard oil and water saying, “Geez, let’s never let it get THAT bad!”
Mafe doesn't always finish tackles or quickly deploy counter moves. Jets game...he's got the ball carrier dead to rights but glitches out and his processor starts buffering. He also gets stuck on blocks and needs to work to his next move or work back into lanes and get hands up at least, almost like he needs to look past the offense into the back field. To me, Hall shows more promise and potential. My guess in Mafe gets decent money elsewhere and we won't match. Same with Woolen.
I suspect the concern about Edge scores may be 'in the middle' is because to make an accurate accessment at this point would require a complex computer algorithym and a sh*tload of luck.Too many changing variables from year to year that effect sack counts. These include, but are not limited to, individual talent (of course), supporting D talent, D scheme, injuries, coaching...ad infinum. Each year the D gears shift and lock into a place that has a profound bearing on the success of Edges and sack count. The potential of any individual Edge is optimized...or not, by ALL these variables. So, how does it look for Edges and sack counts this year? (Drum roll) NO CLUE!
Too Cool! Great time to do the coast! 🎵 These are a few of my favorite things...🎶 Seahawks, playing drums and road trips with my sweetie and the dog who owns me.
One year ago we drafted Murphy over Verse and it seemed like a great pick. In time, we may feel that we got the better player, but right now, with the other guys we have on the roster, Verse would be more valuable. This year we didn't address the pass rush at all in the draft. Emmanwori may provide some juice, but he's got a more diverse role to play. Even if Hall turns the corner and Lawrence is better than we think, we've got to make a new investment at OLB/edge next offseason.
I don't think Mafe will be here and I'm certain Chenna won't. Lawrence is 33 and could be a cap casualty if he's just pretty good. Hall will be entering his final year on the rookie contract. I'm not seeing many scenarios where edge rusher isn't our greatest draft need.
Absolutely. I was pulling for edge this year, Shemar Stewart. I’m not arguing with JS, we needed an IOL, but next year I think we are going to need edge and it’s hard to get an impact edge outside of the first round. I think Mafe has a chance at getting resigned, but it will require a step up this season, and even then, if Hall looks like the top dog, maybe he gets the extension and Mafe gets us a compensatory pick.
Totally. Similar to Witherspooon over Carter. Nothing wrong with the player the Seahawks got and we know Witherspoon is special. But will the general opinion outside Seattle always be the comparison that the elite player at an impact position got past them?
That presumes Carter would have thrived in Seattle. Remember, he was coming off an accident in which he was racing down a Georgia road with another car, and that car went out of control, killing someone and hurting someone else. I don't care who you are, that leaves a scar in your soul. He went to Philly after a buncha teams passed. Philly had a GA teammate already on the DL who Carter knew, and an environment (closer to home, in the bargain) they thought could help him. It worked. Good for them. Would I trade Spoon for Carter? Spoon is a leader on the field. I don't know that Carter is/isn't. We have a terrific secondary, and are one edge rusher short of a terrific DL. It's a solvable problem, either this year when one of our guys figures it out, or in next year's draft. Verse v. Murphy? I dunno. Right now Verse has better numbers. But we're also playing Murphy out of position, and still don't have a NT next to him best I can tell.
Last year as a team we were tied for 8th in the league with a more difficult schedule and in a new MacDonald/Durden system. And without DeMarcus Lawrence. I’m feeling like this is going to be like the 2013 team, maybe no one getting the individual big sack numbers but nonetheless QB’s with happy feet. Might even get into the Top 5 this year
Looks to me the Men have had it with Josh Jones. First we see him embarrassed by our Defense tossing him around like a rag doll, but then those same guys laughing about it in a press conference. That is not done among serious teammates. Either he shows them something or he can pack his bags.
Yeah, I commented a few days back that I'm not sure Jones makes the team. Apparently yesterday was somewhat better for him. But, still. OL seems to be a full-on youth movement. With Cross out for a while we'll see how Jones and the other back-up OTs fare.
If we get 20+ sacks from the combination of Hall and Mafe, and they both play stout against the run, that might not be so awful. Do we want to be paying one person (Edge) $40+ million for 18 sacks when we can get 2 edges and 20 sacks from Hall and Mafe for $30 million? ($15 each) MM has made due with good edges he’s turned into very good effective edges. His defense relies on 11 players out there functioning in the scheme and able to carry out their role on every play. He doesn’t ask an individual player to be Herculean. He gives them a role they are capable of playing. He needs 11 players with high floors and the intelligence to understand what they need to do. It’s a plus to have a Big Cat and a Spoon. You can give them roles that require an elite ability. He understands that when scheming and handing out roles to each player.
I would take the 18-sack guy. A playoff-caliber OL can handle two pretty good players. TJ Watt and Trey Hendrickson are different stories. Plus, there’s going to be another EDGE, even if he’s league average and gives 4-5 sacks. Give me the game changer every time.
The 18-sack guy costs a ton. I think Danno's right, that we get them across the whole team. I suspect Emmanwori gets a handful because he is a handful, for example. We shall see.
Yes he is.
Is O’Toole hurt? I think he could make the team if he gets reps
Mafe doesn't always finish tackles or quickly deploy counter moves. Jets game...he's got the ball carrier dead to rights but glitches out and his processor starts buffering. He also gets stuck on blocks and needs to work to his next move or work back into lanes and get hands up at least, almost like he needs to look past the offense into the back field. To me, Hall shows more promise and potential. My guess in Mafe gets decent money elsewhere and we won't match. Same with Woolen.
Agreed. Hall seems better at setting edge. Why the comment from Reed about him being similar to JLaw is very promising.
I suspect the concern about Edge scores may be 'in the middle' is because to make an accurate accessment at this point would require a complex computer algorithym and a sh*tload of luck.Too many changing variables from year to year that effect sack counts. These include, but are not limited to, individual talent (of course), supporting D talent, D scheme, injuries, coaching...ad infinum. Each year the D gears shift and lock into a place that has a profound bearing on the success of Edges and sack count. The potential of any individual Edge is optimized...or not, by ALL these variables. So, how does it look for Edges and sack counts this year? (Drum roll) NO CLUE!
On road trip of the west coast. Will be back soon! Thanks for keeping this community active while I’m away.
Too Cool! Great time to do the coast! 🎵 These are a few of my favorite things...🎶 Seahawks, playing drums and road trips with my sweetie and the dog who owns me.
Enjoy the Big Sur, Sir.
One year ago we drafted Murphy over Verse and it seemed like a great pick. In time, we may feel that we got the better player, but right now, with the other guys we have on the roster, Verse would be more valuable. This year we didn't address the pass rush at all in the draft. Emmanwori may provide some juice, but he's got a more diverse role to play. Even if Hall turns the corner and Lawrence is better than we think, we've got to make a new investment at OLB/edge next offseason.
I don't think Mafe will be here and I'm certain Chenna won't. Lawrence is 33 and could be a cap casualty if he's just pretty good. Hall will be entering his final year on the rookie contract. I'm not seeing many scenarios where edge rusher isn't our greatest draft need.
Agree. EDGE by definition is always a great need. There is no such thing as having enough pass rushers.
Absolutely. I was pulling for edge this year, Shemar Stewart. I’m not arguing with JS, we needed an IOL, but next year I think we are going to need edge and it’s hard to get an impact edge outside of the first round. I think Mafe has a chance at getting resigned, but it will require a step up this season, and even then, if Hall looks like the top dog, maybe he gets the extension and Mafe gets us a compensatory pick.
Totally. Similar to Witherspooon over Carter. Nothing wrong with the player the Seahawks got and we know Witherspoon is special. But will the general opinion outside Seattle always be the comparison that the elite player at an impact position got past them?
That presumes Carter would have thrived in Seattle. Remember, he was coming off an accident in which he was racing down a Georgia road with another car, and that car went out of control, killing someone and hurting someone else. I don't care who you are, that leaves a scar in your soul. He went to Philly after a buncha teams passed. Philly had a GA teammate already on the DL who Carter knew, and an environment (closer to home, in the bargain) they thought could help him. It worked. Good for them. Would I trade Spoon for Carter? Spoon is a leader on the field. I don't know that Carter is/isn't. We have a terrific secondary, and are one edge rusher short of a terrific DL. It's a solvable problem, either this year when one of our guys figures it out, or in next year's draft. Verse v. Murphy? I dunno. Right now Verse has better numbers. But we're also playing Murphy out of position, and still don't have a NT next to him best I can tell.
Last year as a team we were tied for 8th in the league with a more difficult schedule and in a new MacDonald/Durden system. And without DeMarcus Lawrence. I’m feeling like this is going to be like the 2013 team, maybe no one getting the individual big sack numbers but nonetheless QB’s with happy feet. Might even get into the Top 5 this year
Looks to me the Men have had it with Josh Jones. First we see him embarrassed by our Defense tossing him around like a rag doll, but then those same guys laughing about it in a press conference. That is not done among serious teammates. Either he shows them something or he can pack his bags.
Yeah, I commented a few days back that I'm not sure Jones makes the team. Apparently yesterday was somewhat better for him. But, still. OL seems to be a full-on youth movement. With Cross out for a while we'll see how Jones and the other back-up OTs fare.
I think it will be Team sacks rather than a ton from any one player this year, which is sort of how it was with the Ravens. I don’t care who or how.
Hall was so raw coming out, I think there is upside there. 10-12 would not shock me.
If we get 20+ sacks from the combination of Hall and Mafe, and they both play stout against the run, that might not be so awful. Do we want to be paying one person (Edge) $40+ million for 18 sacks when we can get 2 edges and 20 sacks from Hall and Mafe for $30 million? ($15 each) MM has made due with good edges he’s turned into very good effective edges. His defense relies on 11 players out there functioning in the scheme and able to carry out their role on every play. He doesn’t ask an individual player to be Herculean. He gives them a role they are capable of playing. He needs 11 players with high floors and the intelligence to understand what they need to do. It’s a plus to have a Big Cat and a Spoon. You can give them roles that require an elite ability. He understands that when scheming and handing out roles to each player.
I would take the 18-sack guy. A playoff-caliber OL can handle two pretty good players. TJ Watt and Trey Hendrickson are different stories. Plus, there’s going to be another EDGE, even if he’s league average and gives 4-5 sacks. Give me the game changer every time.
The 18-sack guy costs a ton. I think Danno's right, that we get them across the whole team. I suspect Emmanwori gets a handful because he is a handful, for example. We shall see.
But then there’s Micah Parsons…
I’m fine with a game changer. Just get him in the 1st round next year and don’t pay the super premium for a player nearing the end of his prime.
Yeah, that and our guys will lead the League in interceptions, starting with introducing volleyball moves to Purdy.
That’s the one metric we really need to move. We need to go from -6 to +10 or something in that area.