Not sure how much to value the idea that Plan A was Geno and Sammy was only Plan B. Could he really be that in love with SD under those circumstances? Was he secretly happy Geno decided to hold firm for more money? Who knows... but this feels a little different than falling in love with Mahomes or Allen as prospects.
IMHO, it's not JS's job to worry about the mental state of whomever is the assumed QB1. If he has to do that, he has the wrong QB1. It's MM's job to ensure the QB1 has the support he needs to be successful. The right coaches around him, the words in his ear to challenge him, to guide him, and to motivate him.
JS is there to make the team better, to the best of his ability......now and in the future. If he has a QB slotted in a spot that aligns with when they are on the clock, he'll pull the trigger. If his draft slot doesn't align with where he has the QB's on his board, he won't. I would be shocked if he has anything in his brain saying 'I better not take a QB as Darnold might melt into a puddle.' He's not going to not draft an iLB (sorry for the double negative) if a really good one falls to them, just because he has two really good starters already. He'll take him and leave it for MM to figure out.
I can't remotely fathom all of the Geno banter or acrimony directed at JS about how that went down. The Seahawks made an offer, Geno didn't like it, so they went their separate ways. JS has every right to his evaluations, Geno has every right not to agree. I don't see the problem. MM has supported Geno 100% until he was traded. That's what the coach should do. JS is making business decisions in what he feels is the best interest of the team. We can all agree or disagree, that's totally fair, but impugning his character seems a little over the top. Is John perfect? No, and he would be the first to agree. He would tell you he and his team have to be better, and they do.
Wasn't Favre a succesful QB for Green Bay for a few years after the Packers picked Rodgers in the 1st round? Not all QBs are as fragile emotionally as this article implies. Some in fact are motivated by decisions that might discourage others...
I suppose the cut-off is the 3rd round, under this theory? Because Lynn was supposed to be the man, until Schneider picked Wilson in the 3rd...
The ideas of a QB "feeling wanted" and not drafting any competition for him are not mutually exclusive things. These are people within extensive organizations of other people. The feeling of belonging somewhere and being wanted there requures a holistic approach. I see so many comments (mostly other places, but some here, too) that seem to assume there is no communication or human interaction among players, coaches, GMs, and staff members. It seems like fans have a narrow view and assume it to be all about media interviews and snippets, only. JS never said anything about not drafting other players to compete with the QB so he'll feel wanted. In fact, he mentioned and consistently credits "all the people in the building" with fostering an evironment people want to come to and making sure everyone buys in, including coaches and team support staff. Cooper Kupp also said as much, and cited the environment as a big reason he came here. It wasn't just that he grew up here.
This business is not avatars in a video game on a TV set. It is people trying to come together towards a common goal. And, it is a supremely complicated equation to balance that we have to remember not to underestimate by oversimplifying the decisions made by JS or assuming we know all of the information and aspects of each decision.
I almost posted yesterday to suggest that all the building of $ and draft picks for next year might be a sign they have their eye on a QB to go after then. I guess this still might be the plan and to have Darnold in the mean time is a bonus, especially if he works out. Either way, as others have noted, competition at any position is not a bad thing. So, I don’t think worrying about how a QB feels about being wanted has anything to do with it. With the money they get paid, they are expected to perform. If they can’t handle a bit of competition pressure, then, dare I say it, they ain’t it. I think the ‘poor me’ victim mentality is a large part of what’s wrong with the world these days. Time to toughen up and get back to men being men, and footballers being men’s men.
If your QB1 can't emotionally handle drafting a young QB, you have the wrong QB1 unless he can somehow , magically guarantee that niether he nor QB2 will miss any snaps due to injury! There's a reason teams bring 95 players to camp and only 54 make the opening roster.
The NFL stands for Not For Long and is Darwinian in nature...Only the strong survive. Thus a GM must try to cover all contingencies, including the most important position QB.
The reason some QBs make it are as varied as Ken suggests. Wrong team , wrong system inadequate coaching etc. The truth is that the Hawks got lucky with Russ in the 3rd round.
Note how SSJ purposefully avoids talking about a QB in the 3rd Rd... we see you! Right were most of the expectation for the likes of Leonard, Howard, Ewers and even Shough or Dart are. The dead cap numbers on Darnold are far far from prohibitive, even as early as 2026 (especially designating Post June cut). I'm not convinced he's head-over-heels for Darnold, this is just the usual media talk. The Hawks are doing their due dilligence on the QB class this year including bringing in Shough for a Top30 Visit.
Lest we also never forget, the Packers with Fave and/or Rodgers under Centre drafted 14 QBs (and we all especially know a couple of them were at least somewhat decent). You should never settle, even with a certified HoFer on board. Because you could unearth someone just as good, or better, that gives you a ton of flexibility and a path to sustained success.
If JS is so enamoured with Darnold he rests on his laurels... he'll be outta here soon without another ring and we'll be staring at another long period of abject mediocrity or worse. I don't buy it, JS will have his eyes and mind open if the right QB is there on Day 2.
I am sure Ted Thompson made a lot of bad pics. I think the secret is to have the majority of your pics work out as a starter or a back up part of the problem I think we have had is players that are not any good we hang on to them too long Hoping they will develop and then turn we give up on other players. Often, it is because of draft position off the top of my head we can think of one defensive tackle and one gadget player that we absolutely overdrafted and then kept them around far too long
I honestly don’t think Snyder is all that good of a talent evaluator. I think that was his scouts
I am unsure if it’s some of these terrible contracts in the past if that was Snyder or Pete. The most prominent player was Adams.
I would not be surprised if we did not use a high pick on an offensive lineman or a quarterback. I think we will draft them, but they will be towards the lower rounds.
The DLman you are talking about was a first round pick, and there is a huge difference between first round contracts and all the rest. That difference is they are guaranteed for the first four years. So there is no upside to cutting them unless they are worse than useless.
As per usual, think Joe is right about unlikely to draft a QB.
However, I don't agree with the idea to not draft a QB because of the starter's mental state. I would always draft QBs. Sports are about competition and may the strongest survive. No kid gloves even at the QB position
There’s a more fundamental issue than JS’s predilections (although I think SSJ is right on this read of the situation) which is there are few to no surefire QB’s in this draft. Could in retrospect be as bad as the 2013 class (Geno’s class) or the Kenny Pickett, even though QB’s might go 1/2 (like Winston and Mariotta did). But next year’s draft might be a better test of the thesis
"Then Licht said that one of the reason Baker Mayfield has succeeded with Tampa Bay over other teams (including the Panthers, when he was teammates with Darnold), was that he felt like he was wanted there. To which Schneider emphatically agrees, “Yes!”"
Also John Schneider,
1) When asked about Geno Smith 2024 combine "He's the starter until he is not."
2) In 2023, took the owner's private jet and flew around the country taking selfies with the top QBs in the draft on a very public tour
3) Spent the 2024 offseason trying to recruit Drew Lock and throwing shade at Geno
4) Lowest paid starting QB in the league asks for a raise to show that the team "wants him to be here", he tells him to kick rocks.
Then
"Geno Smith didn't want to be here"
Gee .... I wonder why?
Amazing the amount of hypocrisy one person can accumulate.
I do agree that he has hitched his wagon to Darnold. He has made his bet and IMO his remaining career will ride on that decision. There is some reason to be hopeful and there are plenty of reasons to be doubtful. But, one thing is for sure: Sam Darnold is a JS QB. For better or for worse, I think he needs to own that. I think he needs to back up Darnold and not say, "Well he's our guy until he's not."
At some point in time, you need to stop playing the game passively, getting runover at the poker table, and push your chips in the middle, stand up for your decisions, and go win a championship.
If Darnold turns out great, JS deserves all the credit in the world ... But if he doesn't he deserves all the blame, IMO.
Hypocrisy or did he see, like most of us saw, Geno’s ceiling, thus the Hawks, was limited? They paid Flynn “a lot” only to play RW because he was better, even with those early training wheels. Or keep doing the same things thinking it will be different next year? Is Geno good? Yes. Good floor. But that ceiling was low. And since playing money game (ball), sometimes gotta see if can be better. 4 QBs in over 20 years shows what he was saying in the interview, even if not what you thought best.
Let me try to clarify what Hypocrisy JS is showing. He jumped out of his chair to agree with this statement “… (the QB) succeeded with Tampa Bay over other teams was that he felt like he was wanted there.”
In what way did JS show that he wanted Geno Smith to be there.
As I showed with my comment, he actually did the exact opposite multiple times.
That is the definition of hypocritical.
Where what you say is the exact opposite of what you do. JS is the perfect example of a hypocrite in this example.
I respect everyone's opinion here. I am trying to put the Geno years behind me and move on to the hope and excitement of the team's future, but since this situation is about reading JS and his character now, it kinda goes hand-in-hand, I suppose.
I do have a different take on it that I want to put here because it makes contextual sense. I am not trying to change Mike McD's mind, or anyone else's.
I recall SO many Geno is bad, Geno folds in the clutch, Geno is backup quality only, etc. comments here and on many other sites all last year. It almost became a deliniation of 2-3 different "Geno opinion" camps here. In at least 1 of those almost camps, JS was criticized for going to bat for Geno and "making excuses" for his mistakes, among other statements all year long, which is supporting him. I guess it is possible to read into the plane tour of QBs that he wasn't supporting Geno, but they spoke to Geno and never did any of that behind his back. We also don't know anything JS said to him on a daily basis. We only know what he said in public, which was "we expect Geno to be our starting QB in 2025" over and over again. I never got any idea that JS didn't want him publicly.
Also, he was not the lowest paid starting QB in the league. In fact, Over The Cap has him listed as the 10th highest paid QB by cap hit last year, and 17 QBs made more than him in cash (not including any other bonuses or contract details). Of course there were rookies and backups who became starters as well. Regardless, the assumption that because someone agrees to a contract that is not higher than their actual market value, then that means they are not being supported is not a good assumption. "Supporting" a QB takes many forms in many different interactions and decisions.
Ultimately, all JS can do is foster the best private relationship with his QB that he can and speak positively about him in public while doing what's best for the team. I have seen nothing but that from him publicly, and can deduce from all of his public statements over the years that he probably did right by him privately as well. Part of my fandom is the pride I take in seeing how well all people are respected in the Seahawks organization, Geno or otherwise. In that regard, JS has been remarkably consistent, IMHO. Even if what I have seen from the organization in his tenure has been more rosey than reality, I think we certainly don't have enough information to impune his character.
To me, the way that JS emphatically said “yes!” To lights comment just came off to me as very disingenuous because I just don’t see him as a QB supportive person. It is true the second half of last season both JS and Mike Mac changed their tune. But I didn’t see that in 2022/2023.
Maybe he didn’t realize he is not being supportive?
I think one thing seems to be true: Geno did not feel wanted here.
I think that would probably be a true statement.
So if JS’ goal is to make QBs “feel wanted” I think he failed. And hopefully does a better job with Darnold.
I don’t think it was hypocritical exactly because I don’t think that he wanted Geno to be here. I think Geno was Pete’s guy. Obviously this is just me reading the same tea leaves as the rest of us, but that’s the feeling I get.
And with that, it is overly clear that the whole “Geno didn’t want to be here” campaign is a Seahawks front office/JS campaign move.
Geno is not here because JS did not want him here. Period.
I agree with that and I think JS should step up to the plate and take that on.
Geno is not their guy - Sam Darnold is. Let’s roll the football out there in 5 months and see who is right and who is wrong. I think it will be fascinating
I tend to agree with this … but even if you think that, why wouldn’t you support your QB when he is here? And then come out and say the opposite in an ESPN interview.
So is now JS gonna support Darnold?
Additionally, Why is the front office pretending that Geno decided he didn’t want to be here? Why not come out and say “we saw an option to upgrade and we want Sam Darnold to be here. So we made the trade, got a third round pick, and we feel like Darnold is our guy”
Why leak bogus info that Geno wanted out, and that they offered him $40-$45M a year?
I know a ton of the fan base is falling for it - so I guess props to him. But for me, it’s pretty clear what happened. As you said, JS does not like or want Geno to be here period.
Not at all. And why wouldn’t the FO come out and defend themselves from things Geno said. Both can be true. Just like Geno is good at times but not top at his craft. We can like what Geno did. Rectified a career that looked like he was a major bust, and at same time say his ceiling wasn’t high. If Geno truly did not counter when the contract negotiations were happening, then comes out like he was the victim, then yes FO can speak out. Had Geno kept things positive, I suspect FO does same. Geno ceiling was reached. Not to mention his age, like RW, or Tyler, would be showing.
If a person lists a home at $1.2M and someone comes in and offers them $800K. I don’t think the person even needs to respond. That is just not a serious offer.
Basically exactly what Breer said.
Also, I’m not even sure Genos camp asked for a trade.
If someone doesn’t respond you know what that means? all the means is that they reiterate the price they already stated. That is a response.
I am not drinking the Kool-Aid this front office is serving
Or he saw the ceiling and therefore wasn’t seeing a need to placate Geno. Geno wasn’t going to take Seattle any further than he did. But you can see that they did do exactly that with a young Wilson. So how is it hypocritical when he was looking to replace Geno? If Geno wasn’t his guy of the future, then nothing you said about his actions with Geno are that. He just needed the trigger to make the change. He was playing the wait and see what I can get game.
Great! You finally agree that Geno had nothing to do with him leaving and the whole BS front office campaign “he asked to leave” is a load of BS.
So the GM should only support a young QB? He shouldn’t support the QB that led his team to a winning record in spite of the GM giving him an OC that was not of NFL quality and in spite of giving him an even decent protection from the o line or running game?
Interesting.
Yeah I will disagree with that. The GM should support the QB and not be a hypocrite saying you should. Maybe with Darnold he will. But I doubt it.
"You finally agree that Geno had nothing to do with him leaving and the whole BS front office campaign “he asked to leave” is a load of BS."
If you heard DK on the Get Got podcast (Marshawn's pod), he said that Geno, Tyler and himself felt like "outsiders" and weren't happy under the new regime, naming Grubb specifically. I'm sure it was a bit of a culture shock to go from easy going Pete Carroll to MacDonald, but according to Metcalf at least, they didn't feel heard and it did sound like DK and Geno at least wanted out.
For some reason, I have it in the back of my mind that JS was very interested in SD in that year's draft. I know JS also had his eye on Mahomes and Allen. But still, I seem to remember that he would have liked to have Darnold on the team too - back then! Does that ring a bell or am I barking up the wrong tree?
I have read in several places that JS liked Sam quite a bit, yes. How much, who knows. He was never going to get him given where the Seahawks were picking and where Darnold was going to be drafted.
A large part of JS success or failure will be on QB… to no surprise… I want OL and DL draftees, but let’s not forget about Howell who started 17 games for the Moons… even though he was a deer in the headlights when he played last year.. Have a competition, even draft a young guy, and see what happens
Quarterback being a position so significantly impacted by the psychology of the player, wouldn't a GM value having their QB1 relish competition in the position group?
I agree drafting a guy in the 1st or even 2nd round may be counterproductive if you believe you already have your guy, but not adding talent to the room for fear of messing with QB1-s head seems like poor management.
Meant to post the interview in the body of the article but forgot. It's in there now and here it is:
https://youtu.be/EWRGjA68T2Y?si=scn1FFHDJrKB5vwM
Not sure how much to value the idea that Plan A was Geno and Sammy was only Plan B. Could he really be that in love with SD under those circumstances? Was he secretly happy Geno decided to hold firm for more money? Who knows... but this feels a little different than falling in love with Mahomes or Allen as prospects.
So anyway, how’s Clarke going? Haven’t heard for a while.
This is business, not personal.
IMHO, it's not JS's job to worry about the mental state of whomever is the assumed QB1. If he has to do that, he has the wrong QB1. It's MM's job to ensure the QB1 has the support he needs to be successful. The right coaches around him, the words in his ear to challenge him, to guide him, and to motivate him.
JS is there to make the team better, to the best of his ability......now and in the future. If he has a QB slotted in a spot that aligns with when they are on the clock, he'll pull the trigger. If his draft slot doesn't align with where he has the QB's on his board, he won't. I would be shocked if he has anything in his brain saying 'I better not take a QB as Darnold might melt into a puddle.' He's not going to not draft an iLB (sorry for the double negative) if a really good one falls to them, just because he has two really good starters already. He'll take him and leave it for MM to figure out.
I can't remotely fathom all of the Geno banter or acrimony directed at JS about how that went down. The Seahawks made an offer, Geno didn't like it, so they went their separate ways. JS has every right to his evaluations, Geno has every right not to agree. I don't see the problem. MM has supported Geno 100% until he was traded. That's what the coach should do. JS is making business decisions in what he feels is the best interest of the team. We can all agree or disagree, that's totally fair, but impugning his character seems a little over the top. Is John perfect? No, and he would be the first to agree. He would tell you he and his team have to be better, and they do.
It's just business. It's not personal.
Wasn't Favre a succesful QB for Green Bay for a few years after the Packers picked Rodgers in the 1st round? Not all QBs are as fragile emotionally as this article implies. Some in fact are motivated by decisions that might discourage others...
I suppose the cut-off is the 3rd round, under this theory? Because Lynn was supposed to be the man, until Schneider picked Wilson in the 3rd...
Make that Flynn, of course.
The ideas of a QB "feeling wanted" and not drafting any competition for him are not mutually exclusive things. These are people within extensive organizations of other people. The feeling of belonging somewhere and being wanted there requures a holistic approach. I see so many comments (mostly other places, but some here, too) that seem to assume there is no communication or human interaction among players, coaches, GMs, and staff members. It seems like fans have a narrow view and assume it to be all about media interviews and snippets, only. JS never said anything about not drafting other players to compete with the QB so he'll feel wanted. In fact, he mentioned and consistently credits "all the people in the building" with fostering an evironment people want to come to and making sure everyone buys in, including coaches and team support staff. Cooper Kupp also said as much, and cited the environment as a big reason he came here. It wasn't just that he grew up here.
This business is not avatars in a video game on a TV set. It is people trying to come together towards a common goal. And, it is a supremely complicated equation to balance that we have to remember not to underestimate by oversimplifying the decisions made by JS or assuming we know all of the information and aspects of each decision.
I almost posted yesterday to suggest that all the building of $ and draft picks for next year might be a sign they have their eye on a QB to go after then. I guess this still might be the plan and to have Darnold in the mean time is a bonus, especially if he works out. Either way, as others have noted, competition at any position is not a bad thing. So, I don’t think worrying about how a QB feels about being wanted has anything to do with it. With the money they get paid, they are expected to perform. If they can’t handle a bit of competition pressure, then, dare I say it, they ain’t it. I think the ‘poor me’ victim mentality is a large part of what’s wrong with the world these days. Time to toughen up and get back to men being men, and footballers being men’s men.
If your QB1 can't emotionally handle drafting a young QB, you have the wrong QB1 unless he can somehow , magically guarantee that niether he nor QB2 will miss any snaps due to injury! There's a reason teams bring 95 players to camp and only 54 make the opening roster.
The NFL stands for Not For Long and is Darwinian in nature...Only the strong survive. Thus a GM must try to cover all contingencies, including the most important position QB.
The reason some QBs make it are as varied as Ken suggests. Wrong team , wrong system inadequate coaching etc. The truth is that the Hawks got lucky with Russ in the 3rd round.
I would also argue that Russ got lucky being drafted by the Hawks. Talk about a perfect situation.
Note how SSJ purposefully avoids talking about a QB in the 3rd Rd... we see you! Right were most of the expectation for the likes of Leonard, Howard, Ewers and even Shough or Dart are. The dead cap numbers on Darnold are far far from prohibitive, even as early as 2026 (especially designating Post June cut). I'm not convinced he's head-over-heels for Darnold, this is just the usual media talk. The Hawks are doing their due dilligence on the QB class this year including bringing in Shough for a Top30 Visit.
Lest we also never forget, the Packers with Fave and/or Rodgers under Centre drafted 14 QBs (and we all especially know a couple of them were at least somewhat decent). You should never settle, even with a certified HoFer on board. Because you could unearth someone just as good, or better, that gives you a ton of flexibility and a path to sustained success.
If JS is so enamoured with Darnold he rests on his laurels... he'll be outta here soon without another ring and we'll be staring at another long period of abject mediocrity or worse. I don't buy it, JS will have his eyes and mind open if the right QB is there on Day 2.
I am sure Ted Thompson made a lot of bad pics. I think the secret is to have the majority of your pics work out as a starter or a back up part of the problem I think we have had is players that are not any good we hang on to them too long Hoping they will develop and then turn we give up on other players. Often, it is because of draft position off the top of my head we can think of one defensive tackle and one gadget player that we absolutely overdrafted and then kept them around far too long
I honestly don’t think Snyder is all that good of a talent evaluator. I think that was his scouts
I am unsure if it’s some of these terrible contracts in the past if that was Snyder or Pete. The most prominent player was Adams.
I would not be surprised if we did not use a high pick on an offensive lineman or a quarterback. I think we will draft them, but they will be towards the lower rounds.
The DLman you are talking about was a first round pick, and there is a huge difference between first round contracts and all the rest. That difference is they are guaranteed for the first four years. So there is no upside to cutting them unless they are worse than useless.
Didn't JS draft Russ after paying Matt Flynn a large contract (at that time)? I think competition never hurts. Iron sharpens iron.
As per usual, think Joe is right about unlikely to draft a QB.
However, I don't agree with the idea to not draft a QB because of the starter's mental state. I would always draft QBs. Sports are about competition and may the strongest survive. No kid gloves even at the QB position
If the Hawks have a first round grade on—say—Jaxon Dart and he’s available at #18, Schneider will take him.
I hope so. and would be supportive of that decision for sure.
There’s a more fundamental issue than JS’s predilections (although I think SSJ is right on this read of the situation) which is there are few to no surefire QB’s in this draft. Could in retrospect be as bad as the 2013 class (Geno’s class) or the Kenny Pickett, even though QB’s might go 1/2 (like Winston and Mariotta did). But next year’s draft might be a better test of the thesis
Yeah ... I would agree with that.
I think, as Joe said a while ago, we should be loading up ammo for 2026 draft.
Get a year with Darnold (and Howell), see where we are at, but have the ammo to move up and get a QB in 2026 if we want, is a smart play.
"Then Licht said that one of the reason Baker Mayfield has succeeded with Tampa Bay over other teams (including the Panthers, when he was teammates with Darnold), was that he felt like he was wanted there. To which Schneider emphatically agrees, “Yes!”"
Also John Schneider,
1) When asked about Geno Smith 2024 combine "He's the starter until he is not."
2) In 2023, took the owner's private jet and flew around the country taking selfies with the top QBs in the draft on a very public tour
3) Spent the 2024 offseason trying to recruit Drew Lock and throwing shade at Geno
4) Lowest paid starting QB in the league asks for a raise to show that the team "wants him to be here", he tells him to kick rocks.
Then
"Geno Smith didn't want to be here"
Gee .... I wonder why?
Amazing the amount of hypocrisy one person can accumulate.
I do agree that he has hitched his wagon to Darnold. He has made his bet and IMO his remaining career will ride on that decision. There is some reason to be hopeful and there are plenty of reasons to be doubtful. But, one thing is for sure: Sam Darnold is a JS QB. For better or for worse, I think he needs to own that. I think he needs to back up Darnold and not say, "Well he's our guy until he's not."
At some point in time, you need to stop playing the game passively, getting runover at the poker table, and push your chips in the middle, stand up for your decisions, and go win a championship.
If Darnold turns out great, JS deserves all the credit in the world ... But if he doesn't he deserves all the blame, IMO.
Go Hawks
Cleveland didn’t want Baker Mayfield? That’s an odd message to send to a guy you drafted #1 overall.
Hypocrisy or did he see, like most of us saw, Geno’s ceiling, thus the Hawks, was limited? They paid Flynn “a lot” only to play RW because he was better, even with those early training wheels. Or keep doing the same things thinking it will be different next year? Is Geno good? Yes. Good floor. But that ceiling was low. And since playing money game (ball), sometimes gotta see if can be better. 4 QBs in over 20 years shows what he was saying in the interview, even if not what you thought best.
Let me try to clarify what Hypocrisy JS is showing. He jumped out of his chair to agree with this statement “… (the QB) succeeded with Tampa Bay over other teams was that he felt like he was wanted there.”
In what way did JS show that he wanted Geno Smith to be there.
As I showed with my comment, he actually did the exact opposite multiple times.
That is the definition of hypocritical.
Where what you say is the exact opposite of what you do. JS is the perfect example of a hypocrite in this example.
I respect everyone's opinion here. I am trying to put the Geno years behind me and move on to the hope and excitement of the team's future, but since this situation is about reading JS and his character now, it kinda goes hand-in-hand, I suppose.
I do have a different take on it that I want to put here because it makes contextual sense. I am not trying to change Mike McD's mind, or anyone else's.
I recall SO many Geno is bad, Geno folds in the clutch, Geno is backup quality only, etc. comments here and on many other sites all last year. It almost became a deliniation of 2-3 different "Geno opinion" camps here. In at least 1 of those almost camps, JS was criticized for going to bat for Geno and "making excuses" for his mistakes, among other statements all year long, which is supporting him. I guess it is possible to read into the plane tour of QBs that he wasn't supporting Geno, but they spoke to Geno and never did any of that behind his back. We also don't know anything JS said to him on a daily basis. We only know what he said in public, which was "we expect Geno to be our starting QB in 2025" over and over again. I never got any idea that JS didn't want him publicly.
Also, he was not the lowest paid starting QB in the league. In fact, Over The Cap has him listed as the 10th highest paid QB by cap hit last year, and 17 QBs made more than him in cash (not including any other bonuses or contract details). Of course there were rookies and backups who became starters as well. Regardless, the assumption that because someone agrees to a contract that is not higher than their actual market value, then that means they are not being supported is not a good assumption. "Supporting" a QB takes many forms in many different interactions and decisions.
Ultimately, all JS can do is foster the best private relationship with his QB that he can and speak positively about him in public while doing what's best for the team. I have seen nothing but that from him publicly, and can deduce from all of his public statements over the years that he probably did right by him privately as well. Part of my fandom is the pride I take in seeing how well all people are respected in the Seahawks organization, Geno or otherwise. In that regard, JS has been remarkably consistent, IMHO. Even if what I have seen from the organization in his tenure has been more rosey than reality, I think we certainly don't have enough information to impune his character.
Great comment.
To me, the way that JS emphatically said “yes!” To lights comment just came off to me as very disingenuous because I just don’t see him as a QB supportive person. It is true the second half of last season both JS and Mike Mac changed their tune. But I didn’t see that in 2022/2023.
Maybe he didn’t realize he is not being supportive?
I think one thing seems to be true: Geno did not feel wanted here.
I think that would probably be a true statement.
So if JS’ goal is to make QBs “feel wanted” I think he failed. And hopefully does a better job with Darnold.
I don’t think it was hypocritical exactly because I don’t think that he wanted Geno to be here. I think Geno was Pete’s guy. Obviously this is just me reading the same tea leaves as the rest of us, but that’s the feeling I get.
I agree.
And with that, it is overly clear that the whole “Geno didn’t want to be here” campaign is a Seahawks front office/JS campaign move.
Geno is not here because JS did not want him here. Period.
I agree with that and I think JS should step up to the plate and take that on.
Geno is not their guy - Sam Darnold is. Let’s roll the football out there in 5 months and see who is right and who is wrong. I think it will be fascinating
I tend to agree with this … but even if you think that, why wouldn’t you support your QB when he is here? And then come out and say the opposite in an ESPN interview.
So is now JS gonna support Darnold?
Additionally, Why is the front office pretending that Geno decided he didn’t want to be here? Why not come out and say “we saw an option to upgrade and we want Sam Darnold to be here. So we made the trade, got a third round pick, and we feel like Darnold is our guy”
Why leak bogus info that Geno wanted out, and that they offered him $40-$45M a year?
I know a ton of the fan base is falling for it - so I guess props to him. But for me, it’s pretty clear what happened. As you said, JS does not like or want Geno to be here period.
Not at all. And why wouldn’t the FO come out and defend themselves from things Geno said. Both can be true. Just like Geno is good at times but not top at his craft. We can like what Geno did. Rectified a career that looked like he was a major bust, and at same time say his ceiling wasn’t high. If Geno truly did not counter when the contract negotiations were happening, then comes out like he was the victim, then yes FO can speak out. Had Geno kept things positive, I suspect FO does same. Geno ceiling was reached. Not to mention his age, like RW, or Tyler, would be showing.
What did Geno say? Haven’t heard a thing
If a person lists a home at $1.2M and someone comes in and offers them $800K. I don’t think the person even needs to respond. That is just not a serious offer.
Basically exactly what Breer said.
Also, I’m not even sure Genos camp asked for a trade.
If someone doesn’t respond you know what that means? all the means is that they reiterate the price they already stated. That is a response.
I am not drinking the Kool-Aid this front office is serving
Or he saw the ceiling and therefore wasn’t seeing a need to placate Geno. Geno wasn’t going to take Seattle any further than he did. But you can see that they did do exactly that with a young Wilson. So how is it hypocritical when he was looking to replace Geno? If Geno wasn’t his guy of the future, then nothing you said about his actions with Geno are that. He just needed the trigger to make the change. He was playing the wait and see what I can get game.
Great! You finally agree that Geno had nothing to do with him leaving and the whole BS front office campaign “he asked to leave” is a load of BS.
So the GM should only support a young QB? He shouldn’t support the QB that led his team to a winning record in spite of the GM giving him an OC that was not of NFL quality and in spite of giving him an even decent protection from the o line or running game?
Interesting.
Yeah I will disagree with that. The GM should support the QB and not be a hypocrite saying you should. Maybe with Darnold he will. But I doubt it.
"You finally agree that Geno had nothing to do with him leaving and the whole BS front office campaign “he asked to leave” is a load of BS."
If you heard DK on the Get Got podcast (Marshawn's pod), he said that Geno, Tyler and himself felt like "outsiders" and weren't happy under the new regime, naming Grubb specifically. I'm sure it was a bit of a culture shock to go from easy going Pete Carroll to MacDonald, but according to Metcalf at least, they didn't feel heard and it did sound like DK and Geno at least wanted out.
For some reason, I have it in the back of my mind that JS was very interested in SD in that year's draft. I know JS also had his eye on Mahomes and Allen. But still, I seem to remember that he would have liked to have Darnold on the team too - back then! Does that ring a bell or am I barking up the wrong tree?
I have read in several places that JS liked Sam quite a bit, yes. How much, who knows. He was never going to get him given where the Seahawks were picking and where Darnold was going to be drafted.
A large part of JS success or failure will be on QB… to no surprise… I want OL and DL draftees, but let’s not forget about Howell who started 17 games for the Moons… even though he was a deer in the headlights when he played last year.. Have a competition, even draft a young guy, and see what happens
I thought, before we traded Geno, it made sense to draft a backup QB on day three. Still mostly do.
Agreed!!
Quarterback being a position so significantly impacted by the psychology of the player, wouldn't a GM value having their QB1 relish competition in the position group?
I agree drafting a guy in the 1st or even 2nd round may be counterproductive if you believe you already have your guy, but not adding talent to the room for fear of messing with QB1-s head seems like poor management.
100% agree.