I disagree. Look, most of us have played football and some of us have coached it. My approach is if you have young kids you have to teach them to believe in themselves and their team. You don’t do that by playing statistical odds. You play by momentum, by mindset, and potential result. So Look at the situation. You play by statistics and you get 3 points. But you lose your mo and you’re teams confidence In you. Do you really think you’re D is going to rise.up and get you a 3 and out? Or you’re O has another long drive in them? No, you go for it. If you don’t get it you still have shone your team that you believe in them, and come Monday’s practice you have a teaching moment. What good was the 3 points anyway? It costs you in the long run.
Well, subject matter has changed since my last comment. I am not anti-Pete and I understand the odds but this is going to be a lost season so why not let them go for it and show them you believe in them. The game was gone at that point anyway so screw the odds. Give us them a shot.
Going to be a long season. I don't know how much the team they were playing had to do with it but the for the first half the offense was an improvement over last week. Maybe if they can make adjustments to improve the offense they can to the same for the defense. Then again, they have to figure out how to fix things for the seconds halfs.
I went as far through the comments as I could stomach... we all knew that games like this were going to happen. It's not the end of the world that it did, what will be interesting to see is what happens next. Do they improve or is it just a shit show from here on out. My guess is we'll see improvement provided there aren't knee-jerk reactions to this.
To my eyes we were one dubious holding call away from winning this. Geno was moving the team on that final drive, the refs couldn't restrain themselves from calling a penalty where it's debatable a penalty occurred and a very good interior defensive lineman blew up our journeyman center to get instant pressure on the next play and that was all she wrote.
If the Hawks win, most people are happy and these same comment threads are filled with happy fans. But one crucial call went against the Hawks and the sky is falling in. Meh. All I want to see is the response to the obvious problems we saw in this game. Rushing defense - terrible. 2nd half offense - terrible. Getting 3 and outs on defense - couldn't be worse. But I think we're seeing improvement in the run game. I think Geno does a good job of keeping the offense on track by taking the checkdowns when it's needed. Hell, I'm super happy to see consistent throws over the middle.
We all knew this season would try our patience mightily, let's just see where it all shakes out by the end of the season. And for fun, compare the results for this squad to how the Hawks started in 2011. It's pretty interesting.
One thing will make the difference for possible Pro Bowls. I played 25 years of top flight rugby. This is bragadoshes but its the only way to explain it.In Rugby you play offense and defense. If I get to reved up it could lead to a missed play. I should make my position clear it was a mixture of free safety and quarterback. What worked best for me is I had God given speed. And i worked super hard on the basics which got me out of all sorts of trouble. To all Seahawks rookies concentrate on the basics. At both of your sizes work on your basics. Get so good at your basics, that Pete and Shane see all pros by mid-season next year. Cheers big ears go get them.
Jackson had a rough day so lets throw him on the trash heap. Really? If he plays the same way against Detroit then he'll see the bench. If he rebounds that'll tell us something as well. Good corners are built, not born.
I will not dribble on about are second half performance. Hopefully Nix will play at a level he could go late 3rd round, I believe Seattle may choose him there.
I really think he has the tools to be a much better, Kurt Cousins.
I think this is good and the ilk thar Pete would love.
Like I said I won't dribble on about Bo's off field issue , minor as it is.
It's OK Seattle I saw some promise, I will not make a guess just yet. I will say it go HAWKS. sorry for the odor right at the end
-You can write off Tanner McKee. It's not that he has no talent but rather I don't think he'll heal up in time for the combine after the beating he took this weekend.
-Tyler Van Dyke will have to rise from the dead after being benched against Middle Tennessee State.
-Jalon Daniels showed he and KU are for real.
-Sam Hartman could be a steal in the draft as teams worry about the longterm impact of Paget-Schroetter syndrome. He's now has the Pete/John favorite trait of having overcome a personal tragedy. The literature says there should be minimal longterm effect as long as the condition was treated properly.
-Anthony Richardson The pundits talk about his "immense potential" but so far he's 65 or 121 for 53.7% with 2 TDs and 5 ints. Unless he intends to be the first successful run-first QB in the NFL he doesn't warrant even a second round grade.
-Uiagalelei is doing better than I thought. He's 83 of 129 for 64.3% with 10 tds and 1 int but those numbers have come against an unimpressive lineup of Georgia Tech, LA Tech, Furman, and Duke.
-Henden Hooker runs the the nation's 1st (yds) or 2nd (tds) ranked offense and his stat line, 81 of 113 for 71.7% with 8 tds and 0 ints looks pretty darn good.
The results from these first three games have me thinking we should put aside any thought of using picks to trade up. There are too many holes on this roster and we'll need every chance we can get to fill them. A quarterback, no matter how good, won't be enough.
Lay a lot of this loss on Pete. We had momentum, we were moving the ball and Pete says “I don’t believe you guys can make 2 yards”. End of Mo, end of confidence, end of game.
I know the Hawks aren’t very good but that’s all the more reason why your coach should back you.
Unless, of course, Pete was right and we wouldn't have made it. Then you'd be criticizing him for going for it. When you have limited talent you coach to minimize mistakes.
I think you can both lay the losses on Pete Carroll and also be happy with Pete Carroll for this season. The two actually aren't mutually exclusive. The Seahawks started losing in March when they traded Russ. it was the right move. The idea that a team can be good and also lose games, it's wishful thinking. This was a mediocre team before the Russ trade. This was a bad team after the Russ trade.
The only reason to call his job security into question is to call into question Seattle's ability to find the right QB. I don't know, maybe that's plausible, but I don't see any great evidence for or against him in that regard. Without any emotional reactions to the last two games being taken into account, I think Pete and John are as good of candidates as anyone else.
They need to be managers who hand the keys over to a great QB. Other needs important too, but Pete needs to find a passing offense somehow in 2023. A strong offense will help attract more defensive talent too.
Neither of us knows what went on between Pete and the offensive cooridnator nor why they chose that strategy in that game. The evidence showing that Pete is inflexible just doesn't exist. Do you really believe that he chooses a game plan simply based on what he did in 2013? Pete has a philosphy based on getting the most out of a player's skill set. He had Russell for ten years so the overall design didn't change a lot and our winning percentage proves the wisdom of Pete's plan. Our current offensive and defensive schemes don't resemble 2005 with USC or 2013 with the Hawks. Did you know the Hawks were honored as the NFLs most innovative franchise in 2021?
To quote you Joe, geno is NOTHING but a career backup. Run game....what run game. Pass rush...what pass rush. This is a crappy team hoping that young guys get enough experience that we can have a half assed good team for a (hopefully) new franchise QB. I am a loyal fan and will accept this year as a learning year for the young guys. I would say give geno 2 more games, then let Lock do what he can. I picked today as one of 4 wins for the hawks this year. Falcons are bad, we are worse
The offense was improved over what I watched last week, but, the defense has the same problem it had last year and maybe the year before that. It can’t get off the field unless the other teams scores or makes a bad play. Was it in the 3rd quarter where we had them in a 3rd and 19? Didn’t seem to be much of of a problem for the Falcons getting a 1st down.
Yeah. Seattle’s defense doesn’t have a lot of “wow” players right now. It seems the Russ trade was an inevitability. Both sides needed to split. Russ didn’t want to rebuild with Seattle. Seattle couldn’t rebuild With Russ.
Just having Jamal Adams would have gotten that win. Add to that Tre Brown or better instead of Jackson, who tries his best, but was a liability. And figuring out our 3-4 or abandoning it. All that will make our team much better. Getting Geno more protection from the middle now, would be nice. The Rookie tackles played good. Mafe looked good.
Having Shelby Harris and a veteran LB would have made a difference too. My pre-season concerns about stopping the run are sadly coming true. This team has weapons on offense. Just need a few more studs on defense.
Adams and Harris were out--this team can't afford that. But if Smith/DK hit one or two of those end zone throws that became 3 points, we're still talking about the defense a bit, not in 'the boat's sinking' context.
Smith can make those throws in the middle of the field. That's all that's needed. Hit receivers in stride and let them run for a while. Mariota was just fine throwing that intermediate stuff.
You took glass half empty, and mine was half full. You're a game ahead!
My point was a couple of key positions revamped, and this team is scary. Now? Not so much.
Similar to his first season, in the first game, he looked electric. The defense also looked creative with a couple 3 safety looks. I can't tell since I don't have the all-22 but the defense just feels vanilla right now. Or maybe they're just bad haha
With every game we play, we learn a little bit more about what we have to work with. The defense was going to go through growing pains no matter what, but then losing Jamal Adams almost immediately into the season has really set them back. They designed the defense around him, and no one can fill those cleats. I'm not suggesting Adam's presence makes them a good defense, but I do think they're a little lost without him right now.
They almost fulfilled my vision board wish of 30+ team rushing attempts and they almost won the game.
It'd still be a rough year no doubt. I'm just saying they schemed the defense with his skill set in mind and I don't think they (collectively coaches and other players) have done a very good job of adjusting to his loss.
With the gsme on the line Gino had two sacks and a pick . A winnable game lost because Gino Smith is Gino Smith.
His supporters will point out his stats, but , unfortunately the only stat the counts is wins and losses. His career win loss record defines why he's a 10 year back up.
Another loss next week and it's hello Drew, sit down Gino. What do the Hawks have to lose? Walker needs more touches!!!
And yes the D sucks but it will take time to adjust to a 3 / 4. Another good outside LB would do wonders. Hello JK Wright.
D will improve in time. The O not so much.
How about those Huskies!.Just goes to show how much a good coaching staff can do.
I was always told that good RBs get better with more carries ala Beast Mode and Shaun but with opposing Ds stuffing the box because Gino's inability to throw deep it might not matter this year.
You're probably right. It may take more losses for Pete to sit Gino. I think sometimes Pete's loyalty is a weakness. How else do you explain him hanging on to Norton for so long? He was the most predictable DC in the NFL.
But on a happier note, the rookies look good. I especially like Lucas. He keeps personal stats on his pancake blocks. We are only a good QB and a run stuffing D linemen and an athletic LB (with 2 1st and 2 2nds coming) from the play offs.
I disagree. Look, most of us have played football and some of us have coached it. My approach is if you have young kids you have to teach them to believe in themselves and their team. You don’t do that by playing statistical odds. You play by momentum, by mindset, and potential result. So Look at the situation. You play by statistics and you get 3 points. But you lose your mo and you’re teams confidence In you. Do you really think you’re D is going to rise.up and get you a 3 and out? Or you’re O has another long drive in them? No, you go for it. If you don’t get it you still have shone your team that you believe in them, and come Monday’s practice you have a teaching moment. What good was the 3 points anyway? It costs you in the long run.
Can’t criticize a ballsy call when its a young team going nowhere this season.
Well, subject matter has changed since my last comment. I am not anti-Pete and I understand the odds but this is going to be a lost season so why not let them go for it and show them you believe in them. The game was gone at that point anyway so screw the odds. Give us them a shot.
Going to be a long season. I don't know how much the team they were playing had to do with it but the for the first half the offense was an improvement over last week. Maybe if they can make adjustments to improve the offense they can to the same for the defense. Then again, they have to figure out how to fix things for the seconds halfs.
I went as far through the comments as I could stomach... we all knew that games like this were going to happen. It's not the end of the world that it did, what will be interesting to see is what happens next. Do they improve or is it just a shit show from here on out. My guess is we'll see improvement provided there aren't knee-jerk reactions to this.
To my eyes we were one dubious holding call away from winning this. Geno was moving the team on that final drive, the refs couldn't restrain themselves from calling a penalty where it's debatable a penalty occurred and a very good interior defensive lineman blew up our journeyman center to get instant pressure on the next play and that was all she wrote.
If the Hawks win, most people are happy and these same comment threads are filled with happy fans. But one crucial call went against the Hawks and the sky is falling in. Meh. All I want to see is the response to the obvious problems we saw in this game. Rushing defense - terrible. 2nd half offense - terrible. Getting 3 and outs on defense - couldn't be worse. But I think we're seeing improvement in the run game. I think Geno does a good job of keeping the offense on track by taking the checkdowns when it's needed. Hell, I'm super happy to see consistent throws over the middle.
We all knew this season would try our patience mightily, let's just see where it all shakes out by the end of the season. And for fun, compare the results for this squad to how the Hawks started in 2011. It's pretty interesting.
https://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/sea/2011.htm
One thing will make the difference for possible Pro Bowls. I played 25 years of top flight rugby. This is bragadoshes but its the only way to explain it.In Rugby you play offense and defense. If I get to reved up it could lead to a missed play. I should make my position clear it was a mixture of free safety and quarterback. What worked best for me is I had God given speed. And i worked super hard on the basics which got me out of all sorts of trouble. To all Seahawks rookies concentrate on the basics. At both of your sizes work on your basics. Get so good at your basics, that Pete and Shane see all pros by mid-season next year. Cheers big ears go get them.
Jackson had a rough day so lets throw him on the trash heap. Really? If he plays the same way against Detroit then he'll see the bench. If he rebounds that'll tell us something as well. Good corners are built, not born.
Absolutely!
I will not dribble on about are second half performance. Hopefully Nix will play at a level he could go late 3rd round, I believe Seattle may choose him there.
I really think he has the tools to be a much better, Kurt Cousins.
I think this is good and the ilk thar Pete would love.
Like I said I won't dribble on about Bo's off field issue , minor as it is.
It's OK Seattle I saw some promise, I will not make a guess just yet. I will say it go HAWKS. sorry for the odor right at the end
-You can write off Tanner McKee. It's not that he has no talent but rather I don't think he'll heal up in time for the combine after the beating he took this weekend.
-Tyler Van Dyke will have to rise from the dead after being benched against Middle Tennessee State.
-Jalon Daniels showed he and KU are for real.
-Sam Hartman could be a steal in the draft as teams worry about the longterm impact of Paget-Schroetter syndrome. He's now has the Pete/John favorite trait of having overcome a personal tragedy. The literature says there should be minimal longterm effect as long as the condition was treated properly.
-Anthony Richardson The pundits talk about his "immense potential" but so far he's 65 or 121 for 53.7% with 2 TDs and 5 ints. Unless he intends to be the first successful run-first QB in the NFL he doesn't warrant even a second round grade.
-Uiagalelei is doing better than I thought. He's 83 of 129 for 64.3% with 10 tds and 1 int but those numbers have come against an unimpressive lineup of Georgia Tech, LA Tech, Furman, and Duke.
-Henden Hooker runs the the nation's 1st (yds) or 2nd (tds) ranked offense and his stat line, 81 of 113 for 71.7% with 8 tds and 0 ints looks pretty darn good.
These are great notes! Thank you!
The results from these first three games have me thinking we should put aside any thought of using picks to trade up. There are too many holes on this roster and we'll need every chance we can get to fill them. A quarterback, no matter how good, won't be enough.
Agreed! Although we will see if I change my mind after draft order.
Lay a lot of this loss on Pete. We had momentum, we were moving the ball and Pete says “I don’t believe you guys can make 2 yards”. End of Mo, end of confidence, end of game.
I know the Hawks aren’t very good but that’s all the more reason why your coach should back you.
Unless, of course, Pete was right and we wouldn't have made it. Then you'd be criticizing him for going for it. When you have limited talent you coach to minimize mistakes.
I think you can both lay the losses on Pete Carroll and also be happy with Pete Carroll for this season. The two actually aren't mutually exclusive. The Seahawks started losing in March when they traded Russ. it was the right move. The idea that a team can be good and also lose games, it's wishful thinking. This was a mediocre team before the Russ trade. This was a bad team after the Russ trade.
The only reason to call his job security into question is to call into question Seattle's ability to find the right QB. I don't know, maybe that's plausible, but I don't see any great evidence for or against him in that regard. Without any emotional reactions to the last two games being taken into account, I think Pete and John are as good of candidates as anyone else.
Hmm, (checking out Denver's new head coach). Yep.
With as many good-to-great potential QBs it'll be harder to miss.
Also, can we gift a Seaside Joe subscription to Petre 'n John?
They need to be managers who hand the keys over to a great QB. Other needs important too, but Pete needs to find a passing offense somehow in 2023. A strong offense will help attract more defensive talent too.
The "not a creative genius" designed a defense that was one the greatest in NFL history and was copied by every team in the NFL.
Neither of us knows what went on between Pete and the offensive cooridnator nor why they chose that strategy in that game. The evidence showing that Pete is inflexible just doesn't exist. Do you really believe that he chooses a game plan simply based on what he did in 2013? Pete has a philosphy based on getting the most out of a player's skill set. He had Russell for ten years so the overall design didn't change a lot and our winning percentage proves the wisdom of Pete's plan. Our current offensive and defensive schemes don't resemble 2005 with USC or 2013 with the Hawks. Did you know the Hawks were honored as the NFLs most innovative franchise in 2021?
To quote you Joe, geno is NOTHING but a career backup. Run game....what run game. Pass rush...what pass rush. This is a crappy team hoping that young guys get enough experience that we can have a half assed good team for a (hopefully) new franchise QB. I am a loyal fan and will accept this year as a learning year for the young guys. I would say give geno 2 more games, then let Lock do what he can. I picked today as one of 4 wins for the hawks this year. Falcons are bad, we are worse
Yeah, it could be a change that happens at almost any time.
The offense was improved over what I watched last week, but, the defense has the same problem it had last year and maybe the year before that. It can’t get off the field unless the other teams scores or makes a bad play. Was it in the 3rd quarter where we had them in a 3rd and 19? Didn’t seem to be much of of a problem for the Falcons getting a 1st down.
Yeah. Seattle’s defense doesn’t have a lot of “wow” players right now. It seems the Russ trade was an inevitability. Both sides needed to split. Russ didn’t want to rebuild with Seattle. Seattle couldn’t rebuild With Russ.
It was a cake walk for the offensive line to face the Falcons.
Just having Jamal Adams would have gotten that win. Add to that Tre Brown or better instead of Jackson, who tries his best, but was a liability. And figuring out our 3-4 or abandoning it. All that will make our team much better. Getting Geno more protection from the middle now, would be nice. The Rookie tackles played good. Mafe looked good.
Having Shelby Harris and a veteran LB would have made a difference too. My pre-season concerns about stopping the run are sadly coming true. This team has weapons on offense. Just need a few more studs on defense.
It's not broke beyond repair.
Adams and Harris were out--this team can't afford that. But if Smith/DK hit one or two of those end zone throws that became 3 points, we're still talking about the defense a bit, not in 'the boat's sinking' context.
Smith can make those throws in the middle of the field. That's all that's needed. Hit receivers in stride and let them run for a while. Mariota was just fine throwing that intermediate stuff.
You took glass half empty, and mine was half full. You're a game ahead!
My point was a couple of key positions revamped, and this team is scary. Now? Not so much.
If the Seahawks don’t trade him, it will be a huge get to add Jamal Adams next season.
Similar to his first season, in the first game, he looked electric. The defense also looked creative with a couple 3 safety looks. I can't tell since I don't have the all-22 but the defense just feels vanilla right now. Or maybe they're just bad haha
With every game we play, we learn a little bit more about what we have to work with. The defense was going to go through growing pains no matter what, but then losing Jamal Adams almost immediately into the season has really set them back. They designed the defense around him, and no one can fill those cleats. I'm not suggesting Adam's presence makes them a good defense, but I do think they're a little lost without him right now.
They almost fulfilled my vision board wish of 30+ team rushing attempts and they almost won the game.
Good vision board call!
It'd still be a rough year no doubt. I'm just saying they schemed the defense with his skill set in mind and I don't think they (collectively coaches and other players) have done a very good job of adjusting to his loss.
With the gsme on the line Gino had two sacks and a pick . A winnable game lost because Gino Smith is Gino Smith.
His supporters will point out his stats, but , unfortunately the only stat the counts is wins and losses. His career win loss record defines why he's a 10 year back up.
Another loss next week and it's hello Drew, sit down Gino. What do the Hawks have to lose? Walker needs more touches!!!
And yes the D sucks but it will take time to adjust to a 3 / 4. Another good outside LB would do wonders. Hello JK Wright.
D will improve in time. The O not so much.
How about those Huskies!.Just goes to show how much a good coaching staff can do.
e
I really hope Walker gets more touches against the Lions. It would be great to even see him start a game soon and maybe catch a team off guard.
I was always told that good RBs get better with more carries ala Beast Mode and Shaun but with opposing Ds stuffing the box because Gino's inability to throw deep it might not matter this year.
Agree, but even Pete must know it's hard to run against a stacked line. The fear of Lock hitting some deep balls might help the run game.
You're probably right. It may take more losses for Pete to sit Gino. I think sometimes Pete's loyalty is a weakness. How else do you explain him hanging on to Norton for so long? He was the most predictable DC in the NFL.
But on a happier note, the rookies look good. I especially like Lucas. He keeps personal stats on his pancake blocks. We are only a good QB and a run stuffing D linemen and an athletic LB (with 2 1st and 2 2nds coming) from the play offs.
Geno has not played badly. What makes you think Drew would have even been in the position to win the game on the last drive?