Glad to see Harris picked up, but I would have actually spent some money here since the Center is the true leader on the O-line. Seattle either needs Harris or Olu to jump up significantly or Draft a stud there.
I’m hopeful but have been for years. My guess is they are expecting the Remington winner last year to step up and Harris becomes the cover all backup, potential starter. I want to see a powerful line. Give K9 and Charbo room to run
Want to click Like multiple times. We’ve had a few very good ones. OT critical for all the speed rushers, but the center is the brains and communicates with the others as well and QB. Frankly I equate a top OC (Kelce for example) to almost equal of a LT. I mean we all loved Big Walt.
FYI on Harris, 2 years ago he was slated as the starting OC after sitting behind long term center Trotter. In preseason suffered a bad injury and a former center of Seattle was then picked up and Harris was regulated to backup and “big” blocking run plays (FB for Hunt etc). While 4 starts is not great, he was behind a couple of occasional pro bowlers.
My concern is that Schneider will continue the Seattle tradition of seeming to resent paying above minimum wage for guards and centers. Plus, his draft history for interior lineman is not encouraging:
2011: John Moffitt (75)* [James Carpenter drafted as a tackle]
2012: J. R. Sweezy (225)
2013: Ryan Seymour (220)
2014: Garrett Scott (199) [Justin Britt drafted as a tackle]
2015: Terry Poole (130), Mark Glowinski (134), Kristjan SokolI (224)
2016: Reese Odhiambo (97), Joey Hunt (215)
2017: Ethan Pocic (58), Justin Senior (210)
2018: Jamarco Jones (168)
2019: Phil Haynes (124)
2020: Damien Lewis (69)
2021: Stone Forsyth (208)
2023: Anthony Bradford (108), Olu Oluwatimi (154)
In fairness, Schneider has compensated in free agency with the likes of Austin Blythe, Luke Joeckel, Bradley Sowell, and J’Marcus Webb.
It’s like Schneider drew exactly the wrong lesson from taking Sweezy. Instead of recognizing Sweezy for an outlier, he decided that Sweezy was proof that he could find a project that coaching could turn into, well, a journeyman.
I disagree about draft history, but totally about paying min wage (nfl version). First many drafted tackles generally move inside. But in that above list you have very long career/top money on 7 of those players. Carp, Seeezy, Britt, Pocic, Glow, now Damien were/are quality starting NFL linemen. That’s a good size hit on picks. And a few of them late. They just don’t get the physical glory DBs LBs and sackers get.
I think Britt is the only one who appeared in a Pro Bowl with Seattle, and he was an alternate. Carpenter had a good career and the Seahawks severely underrated Glowinski. Pocic was a mediocrity in Seattle. The rest are just a bunch of guys.
My point was that no they were not just a bunch of guys. In Seattle they may not have been great players, but to have longevity says that they were successful draft picks. Just not here. And as far as the majority listed, they were very late draft picks and so few late rounders actually have careers. 2015 3 guys after 3rd round. 12 are that late. As SJ often points out, starting OTs are generally 1st or 2nd. And jury is out on Olu and Bradford but they’ve looked good. PC didn’t seem to put much emphasis on OLine. He traded Max away as a prime example. And Glow wasn’t recognized.
I have to believe our O and D lines will improve despite all the new players and coaches. Being worse than last season seems almost impossible. I was a teen in NYC in 1969, and the Amazin' Mets had the famous rallying cry, "Ya gotta believe!"
Great points. This to me is the big story in FA so far (the emphasis on interior lineman). Very unfortunate as this is exactly where the Seahawks need to invest and focus on.
I think the FA and offseason are going great so far. There seems to be so much discourse around QB of the future, which I get its football fans always want to talk about the QB, but, the real question to me is who are the tackles of the future? The coaches and GM need to figure out prior to the draft: what to do with the tackles.
1) I think you ride out Cross and hope that his injury was worse than reported last year. I don't have PFF but by my eye he is a good pass blocker and average run blocker. Can he get better at run blocking?
2) What is Lucas' health? This is the biggest question. If there is any question about his health, drafting a tackle should have strong consideration to be the first pick. By most accounts this is a strong Tackle class and we will have one to many available at 16. Even if Lucas turns out to be healthy, kick him to guard or draft Fautano and put him at guard.
There was no cohesion last year with the line. Part of that was injuries but part of it is also construction. We have a great pass blocking left tackle and then we draft a RG that can't pass block but is a great run blocker. And is a massive person. We need to figure out who we want to be up front ... finesse pass blockers? Big mauling run blockers? I look at what the Rams have done (great article on the Athletic) and they have completely switched to a gigantic zone blocking line. This makes a ton of sense as LBs have gotten smaller to deal with passing.
I would even add that there are so many tackles available that they could trade down and select a tackle that would be on the same tier as the 16th pick while picking up a third. With the extra third you can grab a guard. That to me would be an ideal draft.
Here is what I think today is most likely:
Pick 1 Tackle/Guard
Pick 2 and 3 QB/LB
Later rounds safety
Of course, within the confines of not reaching for position and trying to take best player available and good character players.
Agree with almost all of this. The new coaches are supposedly teachers first, so I'm hoping that there is some growth with some of the existing players. Mike Mac has said other teams will not like to play against us. If he makes that come true, players better be ready to be salty on game day, and execute their assignments correctly.
As to your Pick 1 assessment, I would agree. The high end OT's will dry up mid 2nd round (or sooner). The other options I would put out there for rounds 2 and 3 are TE (Sinnett) or a DL that falls to them. I'd love to think that Marshawn Kneeland would be there in round 3, but I'm thinking we'll need a late round 2 pick (from a round 1 trade down) to get him. He looks like a potential game wrecker, and I like the way he plays.
I like getting Fant back. I also think the Seahawks are really well setup for this draft. I think they can go ahead and get the best player available which is always the best way to draft! If that means Kneeland is within reach - let's get him!
Re Cross, I don’t think that an NFL player can fully recover from an in-season turf toe. They push off on every play, plus an OT is constantly pivoting either in pass pro or to pull for an outside run. An off-season of rest should make a big difference to Cross.
The 16th pick in the 1st round won't get a 2nd round pick,? Surely you jest and don't call me Shirley!
I'm open to counter examples in history
It all depends on a lower pick team's lust for a certain player.
Glad to see Harris picked up, but I would have actually spent some money here since the Center is the true leader on the O-line. Seattle either needs Harris or Olu to jump up significantly or Draft a stud there.
I’m hopeful but have been for years. My guess is they are expecting the Remington winner last year to step up and Harris becomes the cover all backup, potential starter. I want to see a powerful line. Give K9 and Charbo room to run
It's about time someone on this team recognizes the importance of the O-line and especially the center position!
Want to click Like multiple times. We’ve had a few very good ones. OT critical for all the speed rushers, but the center is the brains and communicates with the others as well and QB. Frankly I equate a top OC (Kelce for example) to almost equal of a LT. I mean we all loved Big Walt.
FYI on Harris, 2 years ago he was slated as the starting OC after sitting behind long term center Trotter. In preseason suffered a bad injury and a former center of Seattle was then picked up and Harris was regulated to backup and “big” blocking run plays (FB for Hunt etc). While 4 starts is not great, he was behind a couple of occasional pro bowlers.
My concern is that Schneider will continue the Seattle tradition of seeming to resent paying above minimum wage for guards and centers. Plus, his draft history for interior lineman is not encouraging:
2011: John Moffitt (75)* [James Carpenter drafted as a tackle]
2012: J. R. Sweezy (225)
2013: Ryan Seymour (220)
2014: Garrett Scott (199) [Justin Britt drafted as a tackle]
2015: Terry Poole (130), Mark Glowinski (134), Kristjan SokolI (224)
2016: Reese Odhiambo (97), Joey Hunt (215)
2017: Ethan Pocic (58), Justin Senior (210)
2018: Jamarco Jones (168)
2019: Phil Haynes (124)
2020: Damien Lewis (69)
2021: Stone Forsyth (208)
2023: Anthony Bradford (108), Olu Oluwatimi (154)
In fairness, Schneider has compensated in free agency with the likes of Austin Blythe, Luke Joeckel, Bradley Sowell, and J’Marcus Webb.
It’s like Schneider drew exactly the wrong lesson from taking Sweezy. Instead of recognizing Sweezy for an outlier, he decided that Sweezy was proof that he could find a project that coaching could turn into, well, a journeyman.
I disagree about draft history, but totally about paying min wage (nfl version). First many drafted tackles generally move inside. But in that above list you have very long career/top money on 7 of those players. Carp, Seeezy, Britt, Pocic, Glow, now Damien were/are quality starting NFL linemen. That’s a good size hit on picks. And a few of them late. They just don’t get the physical glory DBs LBs and sackers get.
I think Britt is the only one who appeared in a Pro Bowl with Seattle, and he was an alternate. Carpenter had a good career and the Seahawks severely underrated Glowinski. Pocic was a mediocrity in Seattle. The rest are just a bunch of guys.
Further you miss a guy like Fant Undrafted and ten years later still playing. Star? No. Success? Yes
My point was that no they were not just a bunch of guys. In Seattle they may not have been great players, but to have longevity says that they were successful draft picks. Just not here. And as far as the majority listed, they were very late draft picks and so few late rounders actually have careers. 2015 3 guys after 3rd round. 12 are that late. As SJ often points out, starting OTs are generally 1st or 2nd. And jury is out on Olu and Bradford but they’ve looked good. PC didn’t seem to put much emphasis on OLine. He traded Max away as a prime example. And Glow wasn’t recognized.
I am truly hoping JS changes track a bit here and see's or values the importance of the unit on offense the most important after the QB.
I have to believe our O and D lines will improve despite all the new players and coaches. Being worse than last season seems almost impossible. I was a teen in NYC in 1969, and the Amazin' Mets had the famous rallying cry, "Ya gotta believe!"
Ok ok it was the pennant winning '73 Mets. And I was 20. BFD.
https://youtu.be/0_6trgUpI3I?si=8OatEdOPhGEdJVoK
https://youtu.be/dpk7aX_Qawk?si=YpRXPfoTtYFkHvDk
"...I would hate to see the Seah[BOOM]"
I sooo wanted to see how that sentence ended. The tragedy of nuclear war strikes again. 😜
Great points. This to me is the big story in FA so far (the emphasis on interior lineman). Very unfortunate as this is exactly where the Seahawks need to invest and focus on.
I think the FA and offseason are going great so far. There seems to be so much discourse around QB of the future, which I get its football fans always want to talk about the QB, but, the real question to me is who are the tackles of the future? The coaches and GM need to figure out prior to the draft: what to do with the tackles.
1) I think you ride out Cross and hope that his injury was worse than reported last year. I don't have PFF but by my eye he is a good pass blocker and average run blocker. Can he get better at run blocking?
2) What is Lucas' health? This is the biggest question. If there is any question about his health, drafting a tackle should have strong consideration to be the first pick. By most accounts this is a strong Tackle class and we will have one to many available at 16. Even if Lucas turns out to be healthy, kick him to guard or draft Fautano and put him at guard.
There was no cohesion last year with the line. Part of that was injuries but part of it is also construction. We have a great pass blocking left tackle and then we draft a RG that can't pass block but is a great run blocker. And is a massive person. We need to figure out who we want to be up front ... finesse pass blockers? Big mauling run blockers? I look at what the Rams have done (great article on the Athletic) and they have completely switched to a gigantic zone blocking line. This makes a ton of sense as LBs have gotten smaller to deal with passing.
I would even add that there are so many tackles available that they could trade down and select a tackle that would be on the same tier as the 16th pick while picking up a third. With the extra third you can grab a guard. That to me would be an ideal draft.
Here is what I think today is most likely:
Pick 1 Tackle/Guard
Pick 2 and 3 QB/LB
Later rounds safety
Of course, within the confines of not reaching for position and trying to take best player available and good character players.
Agree with almost all of this. The new coaches are supposedly teachers first, so I'm hoping that there is some growth with some of the existing players. Mike Mac has said other teams will not like to play against us. If he makes that come true, players better be ready to be salty on game day, and execute their assignments correctly.
As to your Pick 1 assessment, I would agree. The high end OT's will dry up mid 2nd round (or sooner). The other options I would put out there for rounds 2 and 3 are TE (Sinnett) or a DL that falls to them. I'd love to think that Marshawn Kneeland would be there in round 3, but I'm thinking we'll need a late round 2 pick (from a round 1 trade down) to get him. He looks like a potential game wrecker, and I like the way he plays.
Great comment.
I like getting Fant back. I also think the Seahawks are really well setup for this draft. I think they can go ahead and get the best player available which is always the best way to draft! If that means Kneeland is within reach - let's get him!
Re Cross, I don’t think that an NFL player can fully recover from an in-season turf toe. They push off on every play, plus an OT is constantly pivoting either in pass pro or to pull for an outside run. An off-season of rest should make a big difference to Cross.
Good points. I'm optimistic!
If he can take a step forward especially in run game that would be incredibly important.
In general, if the Seahawks get back Lucas and Cross to near full health you are almost looking at two new starting tackles for 2024 in a way.
What kind of money will Mekhi Becton get? At his size it seems like a move to guard would make a ton of sense, plus offer a backup plan at tackle…
You never know how much a team will overpay a first round bust.
https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/seattle-seahawks/luke-joeckel-12282/
Haha ... C'mon. Rubbing salt in a wound. haha
Tom Cable said that Joeckel was the best guard in the NFL.
I have no idea how good a coach Cable was; I’m positive that he set ridiculously high expectations.