Adding another thing: CPOE was really good for both Russ and Geno (even higher than Russ) last year. How much of that is Lockett and his magic tiptoes?
Keep Lockett. With many high draft picks being average or busts , why trade a pro bowl receiver for a an unknown quantity. He hasn't shown any loss of skills, in fact he just keeps on making plays. Hawks are still looking for a good 3rd receiver so why move Lockett?
It's all about value. If a team offers a second and third round pick, as the Rams did for Miller, I think Seattle has to take it. If anyone offers a first, he's gone. For just a second, I'd probably hold out because we should be able to get that going into the 2023 draft if we want. Assuming he stays healthy. Would not take anything less than a second.
Seattle has in the past held onto veterans too long. Could have traded Thomas to the Cowboys. I think they were offering a second. Could have traded Wags. Maybe it made sense to hold onto players until they were clearly in decline when it arguably wouldn't take much to put Seattle over the top. We're not there anymore so Schneider and Carroll have to think differently.
Everything reason you have mentioned for trading Tyler Lockett are legitimate. I don't care I don't want to see it happen. That and $6.50 will get you an imperial gallon of gas.
I'm torn on the matter, but this hits home. I've loved Lockett since his K State days, and don't "want" to see it happen either, but I'm not sure it wouldn't be what's best for the team. He's a genuine good person, hard worker, helps the new receivers, and has nothing bad to say about the team (or much of anybody). He's the kind of leader you want influencing your young players. On the other hand I've watched this team decline since 2015 or so and it seems that a big reason for it is personnel decisions. We've kept our guys for too long and given out 2nd and 3rd contracts when in retrospect we'd have been better off moving on like the Patriots tend to. And then we get no draft capitol for them and wind up overpaying for mid level vets who aren't good values (or often even good fits) to plug holes. This approach has been good enough to typically make the playoffs and get bounced in the 1st round when we had Wilson. With no top 10 (or 32) QB, a new approach needs to be taken. It feels like this year's draft was a step in that direction but roster management has to be better.
In fairness, Tyler is on a team-friendly contract whereas DK is not going to be. In my mind, the receiver pay scale is bloated right now. And it sure feels like more supremely talented players are coming out of college at that position than ever before. This team has been at its best when zigging when everyone else zags. Although if we were going to trade Metcalf the time to do so would have been before the draft.
All well said. Tyler brings intangibles that can't be manufactured. Sure the soulless Patriots have done things well, but they have not been able to develop receivers. Having played top level rugby, every team needs a few old heads that everyone can look to. Tyler brings the aura of confidence, that translates to, if he is not afraid at his size why should I be.
Unless Tyler suffers a terrible injury he has a number of great years left. As the receiver market goes his 2025 salary might not look bad. His size will allow him to retain his speed much like a Darrell Green, not that he is that fast. One other reason is if you keep Tyler it will help attract free agents when we push for a Super Bowl in the next couple of years. With the quarterbacks available next year, and our defense being run by Clint I would not doubt the playoffs are probable for 2023.
Lastly I do not see Seattle getting fair compensation for Tyler especially mid season.
I understand all your points and each one is valid.
Tyler has been so underrated by the national press its criminal. Good chat
I really wouldn't like to see Lockett traded. If the reports right now have any merit and DK is on track for a $110M contract, I would expect Lockett to be a very unhappy Hawk if he doesn't get a raise.
I think Lockett is, today, the face of the franchise.
Winning is not the only thing GMs care. They care about making money, and winning is one way of doing that, but Lockett is a fan favorite that brings a lot of greenbacks.
Bang for buck, trading Metcalf is a much better deal.
If receivers could play forever, I'd agree. The reality is Locket is five years older than DK. Turns 30 this year. Few receivers play well into their mid-thirties.
I'm all for a youth movement at this point. As you point out, Tyler is going to have aged out by the time we have a drafted QB with some experience under his belt. If I'd have known Russell was getting traded, I wouldn't have resigned Diggs or Dissly or signed Nwosu. We had $120 MILLION under the cap for 2023 when Russ came off the books and now that number is looking more like $50M. I was hoping we'd draft a great new QB and make some splash free agent signings and the $ is already drying up. The last thing we need are expensive vets whose contracts aren't absolute deals for both their level of play and positional value.
You can still sell the team as a viable destination for FAs with guys like Tyler on board. If you wholesale sell off, it starts looking like the Jags or Lions. Diggs and Disley are noted 'locker room' guys, while Ucheena's only 25years old. Taylor, Nwosu, Brooks and Adams form a pretty young, viable defensive presence. DK, Fant, and Penny are that on the other side of the ball.
I understand many are in the 'rebuild' mentality because of Wilson and Wagner, but I just don't really believe that. And, Kenneth covered in this article with the 'and if they get to x month, and...'
If Tyler wants to go to a team with SB possibility, I'm sure his agent will do some back channel stuff to let the team know. Some guys might be okay playing out the string with the same team, same city, and trying to make it work.
Adding another thing: CPOE was really good for both Russ and Geno (even higher than Russ) last year. How much of that is Lockett and his magic tiptoes?
Keep Lockett. With many high draft picks being average or busts , why trade a pro bowl receiver for a an unknown quantity. He hasn't shown any loss of skills, in fact he just keeps on making plays. Hawks are still looking for a good 3rd receiver so why move Lockett?
It's all about value. If a team offers a second and third round pick, as the Rams did for Miller, I think Seattle has to take it. If anyone offers a first, he's gone. For just a second, I'd probably hold out because we should be able to get that going into the 2023 draft if we want. Assuming he stays healthy. Would not take anything less than a second.
Seattle has in the past held onto veterans too long. Could have traded Thomas to the Cowboys. I think they were offering a second. Could have traded Wags. Maybe it made sense to hold onto players until they were clearly in decline when it arguably wouldn't take much to put Seattle over the top. We're not there anymore so Schneider and Carroll have to think differently.
Everything reason you have mentioned for trading Tyler Lockett are legitimate. I don't care I don't want to see it happen. That and $6.50 will get you an imperial gallon of gas.
I'm torn on the matter, but this hits home. I've loved Lockett since his K State days, and don't "want" to see it happen either, but I'm not sure it wouldn't be what's best for the team. He's a genuine good person, hard worker, helps the new receivers, and has nothing bad to say about the team (or much of anybody). He's the kind of leader you want influencing your young players. On the other hand I've watched this team decline since 2015 or so and it seems that a big reason for it is personnel decisions. We've kept our guys for too long and given out 2nd and 3rd contracts when in retrospect we'd have been better off moving on like the Patriots tend to. And then we get no draft capitol for them and wind up overpaying for mid level vets who aren't good values (or often even good fits) to plug holes. This approach has been good enough to typically make the playoffs and get bounced in the 1st round when we had Wilson. With no top 10 (or 32) QB, a new approach needs to be taken. It feels like this year's draft was a step in that direction but roster management has to be better.
In fairness, Tyler is on a team-friendly contract whereas DK is not going to be. In my mind, the receiver pay scale is bloated right now. And it sure feels like more supremely talented players are coming out of college at that position than ever before. This team has been at its best when zigging when everyone else zags. Although if we were going to trade Metcalf the time to do so would have been before the draft.
All well said. Tyler brings intangibles that can't be manufactured. Sure the soulless Patriots have done things well, but they have not been able to develop receivers. Having played top level rugby, every team needs a few old heads that everyone can look to. Tyler brings the aura of confidence, that translates to, if he is not afraid at his size why should I be.
Unless Tyler suffers a terrible injury he has a number of great years left. As the receiver market goes his 2025 salary might not look bad. His size will allow him to retain his speed much like a Darrell Green, not that he is that fast. One other reason is if you keep Tyler it will help attract free agents when we push for a Super Bowl in the next couple of years. With the quarterbacks available next year, and our defense being run by Clint I would not doubt the playoffs are probable for 2023.
Lastly I do not see Seattle getting fair compensation for Tyler especially mid season.
I understand all your points and each one is valid.
Tyler has been so underrated by the national press its criminal. Good chat
I really wouldn't like to see Lockett traded. If the reports right now have any merit and DK is on track for a $110M contract, I would expect Lockett to be a very unhappy Hawk if he doesn't get a raise.
Tyler Lockett knows his deal is a good one which may not make it to the end. Tyler is not the type, I don't think ?
I think Lockett is, today, the face of the franchise.
Winning is not the only thing GMs care. They care about making money, and winning is one way of doing that, but Lockett is a fan favorite that brings a lot of greenbacks.
Bang for buck, trading Metcalf is a much better deal.
If receivers could play forever, I'd agree. The reality is Locket is five years older than DK. Turns 30 this year. Few receivers play well into their mid-thirties.
Tyler Lockett is the face of franchise today for two reasons above all others:
-The Franchise traded away Russell Wilson
-The Franchise cut Bobby Wagner
To imply that Tyler Lockett is safe because of John Schneider and Pete Carroll is to ignore dozens of transactions in the last eight years
I'm all for a youth movement at this point. As you point out, Tyler is going to have aged out by the time we have a drafted QB with some experience under his belt. If I'd have known Russell was getting traded, I wouldn't have resigned Diggs or Dissly or signed Nwosu. We had $120 MILLION under the cap for 2023 when Russ came off the books and now that number is looking more like $50M. I was hoping we'd draft a great new QB and make some splash free agent signings and the $ is already drying up. The last thing we need are expensive vets whose contracts aren't absolute deals for both their level of play and positional value.
You can still sell the team as a viable destination for FAs with guys like Tyler on board. If you wholesale sell off, it starts looking like the Jags or Lions. Diggs and Disley are noted 'locker room' guys, while Ucheena's only 25years old. Taylor, Nwosu, Brooks and Adams form a pretty young, viable defensive presence. DK, Fant, and Penny are that on the other side of the ball.
I understand many are in the 'rebuild' mentality because of Wilson and Wagner, but I just don't really believe that. And, Kenneth covered in this article with the 'and if they get to x month, and...'
If Tyler wants to go to a team with SB possibility, I'm sure his agent will do some back channel stuff to let the team know. Some guys might be okay playing out the string with the same team, same city, and trying to make it work.