I find it beyond comprehension to see the comments that took only the narrowest focus to justify an assault of words against the author. There were multiple possibilities addressed in the article but leave it to the critics to hone in on the one that makes them think they look like they are front office insiders who will be spending the holidays with their BFF Pete because they know exactly how he thinks.
Do people blackout after they read one sentence that compels them to jump off the handle and go on a tirade that wasn’t even the central theme of the article? If you are going to pick your battles to encourage thoughtful debate then pick smarter battles! Please.
Pete is an honorable man. Truly. He lives by a strict code of ethics that he lives by. Football is not important enough for him to compromise those ethics. You may disagree, of course. Some here have suggested he is being deceitful regarding his comments about Geno, and who will start. The rules allow for a certain amount of fudging and he may avail himself of those grey areas, I don't deny. But that is not the same thing as making up a story about a non-existent injury to allow him to start Lock, and avoid being seen as benching Geno. If he wants to bench Geno, he would bench Geno, and ask Geno to be the backup. He wouldn't make up stories and sign Rich Gannon to be the backup.
Truly honorable men do not compromise with their ethics.
It’s especially absurd when you consider Geno is coming off an elite performance, a performance so good that Pete said on Friday “watch out for us in the playoffs”. Do those comments sound like someone looking to sneakily bench his starting QB?
Not even close.
It reminds me of the earth is flat people ... “we’ll have you seen the earth from above? So how can we be sure it’s not flat?” That line of reasoning has no ending.
I don’t know if Geno has an injury, a niggle or nothing at all. I certainly don’t know Pete well enough to know what his ethics are. I don’t know anyone other than maybe his family would (are you related?).
Regardless of that, if Pete is actually not being truthful about an injury to Geno (I’m not saying he is. I simply don’t know), I don’t think this is compromising his ethics - at least not a lot. It would be more about protecting Geno and being faithful to him. Protecting him from potential embarrassment. It would be out of kindness. I think kindness trumps a little white lie to protect a friend in the ethics department.
No, I am not a family member. I attribute honor to everyone until they prove that wrong. Pete has had multiple opportunities to show me his lack of honor, and so far he is batting 1.000. So I continue to attribute honor to him. That is 100% my reasoning. I could be wrong, but I doubt it.
I agree with your analysis, and your idea about kindness.
“ it was the best of times it was the worst of times” Drew at his best is pretty darn good. See victories as a rookie in Denver. At times in Denver he looked great, other times not so much. Pretty typical for a young quarterback with Only 24 games under his belt, Trying to find his way in the NFL. There is a backstory but too long to recite here.
He’s got the talent I believe NFL profile backs me up on this . If PC start him with reps and not just as a last minute Throw in,I also believe he will do well .In any case the talent will be obvious .Beat the 49ers.? In the best of circumstances, I think that may be a Bridge too far. I do know with Drew the game will not be dull.
Dear Seaside- I really enjoy your off season analysis of needs and cap space you have a great handle on all of that info. Where you are really falling down is your negative spin on Pete’s statements about the team. Be it injury or performance. Implying that Pete is lying about Geno”s groin when Pete has gone to the ends of the earth in his support of Geno. Also find it irritating that you put out the “ fire the coach/coaches” musings. All of these things show a lack of understanding where this team is maturity wise. Also a lack of knowledge of Pete’s history on having his teams improve every season. This was always gonna be a near .500 season. The pieces are for the most part in place. Enjoy watching them improve in all areas ! Legitimate Contending will be rightfully expected next season. For now, enjoy the process.
Regardless of who starts at QB, we aren’t beating the Niners with Charbonnet and Dallas at RB. We also aren’t beating the Niners without actual pursuit on defense.
I cannot believe this is some Pete scheme to throw off SF or to "see what Lock has". It just doesn't match up with anything else we've seen from Pete recently. The answer I believe is a simple, Geno tweaked something and we can't afford to play anything less than 100% against the 49ers.
It does also neatly shift the pre-game conversation away from Adams, and provide a neat cover in case we get crushed. Now that's where I see Pete being cynical, not in stoking a QB controversy.
I must respectfully non-concur. The current HC/GM combination has shown that they are willing to operate quite ruthlessly, with consideration for few notions of propriety. It is not beyond them to concoct a story allowing them to dodge Smith's incentives by sitting him down, if they believe their post-season prospects to be toasted on both sides. Same true for unceremoniously cutting him after the season.
If they truly believe their post-season is gone (which we as fans know is true) it'd be a frankly embarassing climb down leading some very very uncomfortable questions for Pete and John. There have been other players operating at a considerably worse level than Geno who have not been dropped, or even seen a notable decline in snap counts. Even if Geno played at a statistical level similar to the Cowboys game through the rest of the season, I think he still misses nearly every single incentive trigger in his contract - but if he could play like that every week i'd actually be happy to run with him as that kind of improvement is what we've been asking for and is a great base to move on into 2024 with.
You play your 100% best team against SF regardless. Pete knows the fans would hate him if he got cute in team selection for this game above almost all others. Because if we could somehow make things finally click in this week to get a win, get Geno playing well, the Eagles game takes on a whole new look as does the rest of the season, with the playoffs right back in our hands and control.
I belive it is solely related to an actual injury worry. We saw how the last game vs the 49ers with a less than 100% Geno was not good. Get ahead of the narrative from Pete so the fans, media, and team, know there is a chance Lock maybe thrown in a very deep end. Otherwise those very uncomfortable questions will be coming hard and fast at Pete, including rapidly rising demands for some very serious changes in the off-season such as the exit of Pete Caroll.
I could see it happening as if Smith has a groin pull. I suspect they do want to see what lock can do as I don’t believe they can afford to keep Smith next season under his current deal. They have invested so much in mediocre players with contracts that are going to be hard to get out of with a significant cap hit.
Well now we have the conundrum I feared. It seems to me that Pete is finally making ‘noise’ about starting Lock. Is it coz Geno’s injury is that bad, or is it coz the season’s on the line and Geno just ain’t it?
The conundrum now is that if Lock turns out even worse than Geno, the seasons definitely at its end. If he actually plays well, it might be too late coz it can take a couple of games to get going. It’ll be unfair on Lock to put him in that position. Particularly as we now need to win pretty much from here on, and his first opportunity comes against a team that has owned us for quite some time. It’s a lot of pressure and I hope he’s up for the task.
PC and JS are always looking at next year and the year after. This move will determine who grooms our next QB and when it starts, which then dictates the new budget and how to achieve their aims and fill the needs. It is how we've remained competitive year in/year out. Athletes at the NFL level have proven to revel in pressure situations. They live for it. They gargle with it, spit it out and ask for more. Being shy or scared on the field will get you gone, fast. Coaches want to see grim determined focus. Russ has it in spades, now he has learned how the anger element was screwing him up. It's the "other level" few can attain. As we perfect this Art of Football, the League is correct in trying to incorporate the martial arts insistence on doing no permanent damage, as men in this state can be deadly. I don't like it but can understand the why of it. Maybe it's a clue to why our Hawks find the bulk of calls weighted against them.
"The conundrum now is that if Lock turns out even worse than Geno, the seasons definitely at its end. If he actually plays well, it might be too late coz it can take a couple of games to get going."
This has been the risk for several weeks now. _Maybe_ a case could have been made for rolling the dice during the weak part of the schedule, but if they came up snake eyes then the gantlet part of the schedule would have been even more painful & the season even more severely toasted.
It was always a high risk season, just like last year.
Geno has had some bad games, even in wins this year but one of them was not last week vs the Cowboys. He missed a couple of gimmes and tossed a bad INT, but it was his best or 2nd best game of the season, IMO. While I hate the thought of Lock starting against a team that's pretty much the old LOB to prove his case as a starter, we will see what he can do, should he be tasked with this. I gave us around a 10% chance of winning with Smith, so c'est la vie. And who knows? Maybe he has the performance of his life. I thought and said here all along that I thought the Eagles were the easiest (and I use that term loosely) of this so-called gauntlet, and we gave a decent showing against the Cowboys. Maybe either of these guys I consider worthy backups but not starters can put on a show! It's happened before. In more than a few games against the Seahawks!
As of early this week, I showed Dallas having a mean OPFOR win rate of 40.5%...but a MEDIAN OPFOR rate of only 33.3%, suggesting that their defensive statistics might over-state their case for being "all that". The RYO eigenvector model (previously commented on) suggested (FWIW, IMHO, EIEIO) they're in the bottom third of the league, which (because of how it propagates scoring instead of won/loss record) is consistent with the median number.
I'm still really, really looking forward to see the 'boys play with their Eagle friends (RYO ranked even lower!) just to see how wrong I can be.
That model has me more than a little bit apprehensive about Sunday's game in San Francisco. I might end up being sorry I ever made that thing.
Dallas has a good defense and probably a deeper defensive line but overall I think San Francisco is a better team I think if Smith plays he has limited mobility wise it would be brutal
Geno Smith had an mvp type performance. He out played in some regards an MVP top candidate. He led his offense to the 9th best offensive output of the year! (to that point)
He threw an interception on an incredible play from a db, a route his wr didn’t win, and he missed it inside. Look at who the top turnovers makers are at QB in the league. Turnovers hurt but aggressive turnovers should be expected and needed to play aggressive football to win.
Geno received a play called on the final play that let Micah parsons attack him unblocked with the only option a third string RB running across the formation to the flat. That is now Geno's fault?
Do we want Geno to call the plays also? Or take Shane’s calls and say no I’m not doing it?
Let’s get some fair QB analysis here ... c'mon man.
I am a lock fan but losing Geno after he played such an incredible game is such a bummer. Did he and Shane turn the corner and learn to get the ball out fast (yes that leads to int sometimes)?
I think Geno will still start because the dude is tough.
I will also be behind lock 💯 if he does go because I also think he has a great chance to be good. Also, it just increases variance of the game but may increase win chances as new QBs often have a spike at the start before the NFL catches onto their tendencies.
We see it the same way. I may not have said it clearly. It was thrown inside. But I would add, it was a great play by DB and the WR didn’t win on the route (or do any favors to protect QB).
I would also add, not all ints are the same. Getting the ball out quick means playing with anticipation. I would rather have Geno say, “boom, I got my guy Tyler one on one, I’m gonna trust him to win therefore I throw now before I know for sure”. Sometimes ints happen. But better that way than holding the ball.
And you can see this by Int %. Who leads the league in Ints? Who is behind Geno in Int %?
Guys like Josh Allen, Pat Mahomes, Tua, Hurts etc.
Why? Because Ints actually aren’t a bigger deal than moving the football and to move the football effectively the ball will be in harms way at times.
You take the bad with the good. But don’t play scared and hold the ball.
"He threw an interception on an incredible play from a db, a route his wr didn’t win, and he missed it inside."
Lockett certainly didn't win his route by any definition of the term, and he's been doing that at important moments this entire year. I hope this is because he's banged up. Otherwise, as much as I like the guy ...he's probably close to popped.
"Geno received a play called on the final play that let Micah parsons attack him unblocked with the only option a third string RB running across the formation to the flat."
Seriously, why do you run your 3rd/4th string RB in DJ Dallas for that play? It just gave me flashbacks of the SB play that shall not be mentioned. Noah Fant or even "friggin' Bobo" would have been FINE for that play call, but Dallas?!? WTF are you thinking, asking him to rub Micah Parsons, then get out and catch a pass in the flat and turn upfield and gain yardage against the 49ers? It was THAT play that made me think I won't be sad if we change OC's this offseason. But I feel bad for Waldron. He was brought in to fix an aging -or at least slowing Russ. "How about we get some great draft picks and you work with Geno and Drew for a while?" -John Schneider probably. But he's driven me crazy abandoning the run back when we had our good ones healthy, our TEs aren't involved enough, etc.. I just feel like there's too much talent to ever suck. And we often have.
1) I think we are witnessing the baton being passed from Lockett to JSN. There is no shame for Tyler as he had an incredible career.
2) agree with everything you said about the last play. It is so frustrating that that is the play. It epitomizes either it works or doesn’t - no plan B.
I’d also say that I was really happy with Shane through the first three quarters. We saw TE chipping again. We saw quick throws. We actually saw the TEs catch some passes! He should be celebrated for that ... but man what a disaster of a final play call and final drive (run for the first down!).
I've been watching our past games to torture myself for no good reason and had 2 big thoughts. #1 was, remember how hopeful we all were when we were 5-2, and barely lost to the Bengals, who are totally a good team? And coming in at second place was the last game I watched where we got stomped by the Ravens. Hard to believe in games like vs Giants that we were an NFL team that could get our shit kicked in by the league's best when they're healthy and playing their best. But we are. We don't have enough asskickers on our team. Pete knows it. John knows it. And why does "hashtag FIRE PETE" go around Twixxer these days and not #firejohn? The Russ trade was awesome, the last couple drafts are looking promising and with one surefire star (Spoon), and a 90%er (JSN). But good lord how long has it been since we had those drafts of old where all these talented picks took jobs?
I don't know, but in my opinion drafts are maybe 1% of the problem. A lot more maybe theoverblown veteran contracts for players who do not contribute that much. At least some of the free agents are working this time.
The asskickers part may be the biggest reason.
But as often in sports, I think if the Hawks had maybe 6 plays the whole season that went the other way they could be 9-3. Reasons were different for each play. And we would have to completely dissect every play to know who has to be blamed for anything and who not.
At least we could watch an mostly exciting squad with young key players, so there could be worse times being a fan.
I love your enthusiasm for Geno, Mike McD. Yes, he did have a good game. But 1 game doesn’t make a season - and look where our season’s at. High chance of no post season. A lot of that is on Geno’s so-so season.
I think it’s looooong overdue for Lock to get a chance. And a chance to me means at least a couple of games, as it can take a couple to get a feel for the atmosphere of it all.
My comment is in response to this paragraph from Joe not the season:
"However, he went just 23-of-41 (second-worst comp% of the season), threw a bad interception to DaRon Bland, had some Ankiel-ish off-target attempts that should have been slam dunks, and didn’t see what he needed to see pre-snap on the team’s final offensive play. Without blaming Geno for the loss, did he earn that fifth shot against the 49ers?"
How in the world do you have an MVP level performance and there is a question whether or not he "earn(ed) that fifth shot against the 49ers?"
Yeah, I understood that. But your overall post and season-long arguments have been very pro Geno. My point is that it’s time to try something else coz Geno isn’t happening for us.
As I stated, Geno’s last game was good. But it was the exception to his season’s performances. I thought SSJ’s points were relevant (yes, I know no game can ever be perfect).
I’m generally conservative with my outlook, but in my opinion, Enough’s enough.
I think part of the reasons I highlight Genos strengths is to:
A) offset Joe who is super negative on QBs. QB position is extremely difficult and organizations get stuck looking and hoping for a savior. I’d rather have a good team
B) to that point. To me the biggest issue is offensive line not QB. By blaming the QB I think it is deflecting the true issues which is O-line
However I was excited last game because it looked like Shane and Geno finally figured it out and said, ya know what my line isn’t very good. Let’s get the ball out quick. And bang: top offense emerged.
Lastly, I am also a fan of lock. I am very different from most people. It’s not Lock vs Geno to me. I think Lock will be good or at least has a good shot at being good.
If he ends up getting the start, I will be slightly bummed for Geno, but very excited to see what Lock can do. And I think he will do pretty good.
This will be good for Geno. I expect Lock will be playing Light's-Out Football. No sliding until a first down is secure, if at all. When the rest of the crew joins in and lights it up, we'll see some true football played, irregardless of pissy officials. All bets are off. If and when Geno is needed, it will be a whole new game and attitude he returns with. We demanded competition and shall see Pete Carrol's definition of it.
I think I would've agreed with you about "good for Geno" if it weren't coming off such a good game.
Last game was extremely exciting. I think you saw the potential of the Hawks offense show through. Quick throws. I think the identity will be DK slants. JSN taking over the torch from Lockett etc.
The Hawks beat the Niners in the last two quarters of the last game and that includes a botched call from the officials.
I know I am in the minority (and I already have bet it) but I had the Hawks winning this game. Without Geno I still think they can, but the variance goes way up.
From a 49er's perspective, who do they prepare for? Pete may field 4 or 5 guys nobody has seen, all of whom have butt-kicking resumes. Does this guy bolt left or right? Which way will this runner juke? What do we know about Lock's habits? How deep can he throw? How is he over the middle? What can we realistically expect from the Defense? The Offense? What's our plan? Tick Tock...2 days... And none of this considers a burning desire among premier athletes to go out and get some of their Street Cred back. While our Hawks no longer control our Playoff picture, we can sure as hell make the list of dangerous teams to play for those who think they have a lock on it. I'm a big believer that a Spoiler can take it all.
It’s been clear to me that if Lock starts, it wouldn’t be because Geno was benched. Lock’s start would be due to an injury. How serious would the injury be? That, we will never know. But Geno will not lose face with a flat out benching under Pete.
I find it beyond comprehension to see the comments that took only the narrowest focus to justify an assault of words against the author. There were multiple possibilities addressed in the article but leave it to the critics to hone in on the one that makes them think they look like they are front office insiders who will be spending the holidays with their BFF Pete because they know exactly how he thinks.
Do people blackout after they read one sentence that compels them to jump off the handle and go on a tirade that wasn’t even the central theme of the article? If you are going to pick your battles to encourage thoughtful debate then pick smarter battles! Please.
What would you consider to be the central theme of the article?
Reading between the lines, I think the central theme might have been Ken turning to Clark & saying "watch what they do when I post THIS".
🫣
That would be hilarious if Joe came out and said ... Syke been messing with you guys this whole time! I am Geno guy.
Playing the long Con is something I respect
Pete is an honorable man. Truly. He lives by a strict code of ethics that he lives by. Football is not important enough for him to compromise those ethics. You may disagree, of course. Some here have suggested he is being deceitful regarding his comments about Geno, and who will start. The rules allow for a certain amount of fudging and he may avail himself of those grey areas, I don't deny. But that is not the same thing as making up a story about a non-existent injury to allow him to start Lock, and avoid being seen as benching Geno. If he wants to bench Geno, he would bench Geno, and ask Geno to be the backup. He wouldn't make up stories and sign Rich Gannon to be the backup.
Truly honorable men do not compromise with their ethics.
It’s especially absurd when you consider Geno is coming off an elite performance, a performance so good that Pete said on Friday “watch out for us in the playoffs”. Do those comments sound like someone looking to sneakily bench his starting QB?
Not even close.
It reminds me of the earth is flat people ... “we’ll have you seen the earth from above? So how can we be sure it’s not flat?” That line of reasoning has no ending.
I don’t know if Geno has an injury, a niggle or nothing at all. I certainly don’t know Pete well enough to know what his ethics are. I don’t know anyone other than maybe his family would (are you related?).
Regardless of that, if Pete is actually not being truthful about an injury to Geno (I’m not saying he is. I simply don’t know), I don’t think this is compromising his ethics - at least not a lot. It would be more about protecting Geno and being faithful to him. Protecting him from potential embarrassment. It would be out of kindness. I think kindness trumps a little white lie to protect a friend in the ethics department.
No, I am not a family member. I attribute honor to everyone until they prove that wrong. Pete has had multiple opportunities to show me his lack of honor, and so far he is batting 1.000. So I continue to attribute honor to him. That is 100% my reasoning. I could be wrong, but I doubt it.
I agree with your analysis, and your idea about kindness.
“ it was the best of times it was the worst of times” Drew at his best is pretty darn good. See victories as a rookie in Denver. At times in Denver he looked great, other times not so much. Pretty typical for a young quarterback with Only 24 games under his belt, Trying to find his way in the NFL. There is a backstory but too long to recite here.
He’s got the talent I believe NFL profile backs me up on this . If PC start him with reps and not just as a last minute Throw in,I also believe he will do well .In any case the talent will be obvious .Beat the 49ers.? In the best of circumstances, I think that may be a Bridge too far. I do know with Drew the game will not be dull.
Dear Seaside- I really enjoy your off season analysis of needs and cap space you have a great handle on all of that info. Where you are really falling down is your negative spin on Pete’s statements about the team. Be it injury or performance. Implying that Pete is lying about Geno”s groin when Pete has gone to the ends of the earth in his support of Geno. Also find it irritating that you put out the “ fire the coach/coaches” musings. All of these things show a lack of understanding where this team is maturity wise. Also a lack of knowledge of Pete’s history on having his teams improve every season. This was always gonna be a near .500 season. The pieces are for the most part in place. Enjoy watching them improve in all areas ! Legitimate Contending will be rightfully expected next season. For now, enjoy the process.
Hmm. “Legitimate Contending will be rightfully expected next season.”
That same conversation was being had at the end of last season. At this stage, it seems they have not improved.
But I agree that there are some pieces in place that give us all hope for next season.
💯
Peddling out a conspiracy theories that are pretty obviously not close to being accurate. Is not something I expected.
I thought it was a joke at first but I’m not sure.
Regardless of who starts at QB, we aren’t beating the Niners with Charbonnet and Dallas at RB. We also aren’t beating the Niners without actual pursuit on defense.
I cannot believe this is some Pete scheme to throw off SF or to "see what Lock has". It just doesn't match up with anything else we've seen from Pete recently. The answer I believe is a simple, Geno tweaked something and we can't afford to play anything less than 100% against the 49ers.
It does also neatly shift the pre-game conversation away from Adams, and provide a neat cover in case we get crushed. Now that's where I see Pete being cynical, not in stoking a QB controversy.
I must respectfully non-concur. The current HC/GM combination has shown that they are willing to operate quite ruthlessly, with consideration for few notions of propriety. It is not beyond them to concoct a story allowing them to dodge Smith's incentives by sitting him down, if they believe their post-season prospects to be toasted on both sides. Same true for unceremoniously cutting him after the season.
Ask Sherman, Wright, or Wagner.
If the plan all along were to start Lock, Carroll would have announced it a week ago Friday.
There’s no such thing as an unceremonious cut of someone who just made $25M.
If they truly believe their post-season is gone (which we as fans know is true) it'd be a frankly embarassing climb down leading some very very uncomfortable questions for Pete and John. There have been other players operating at a considerably worse level than Geno who have not been dropped, or even seen a notable decline in snap counts. Even if Geno played at a statistical level similar to the Cowboys game through the rest of the season, I think he still misses nearly every single incentive trigger in his contract - but if he could play like that every week i'd actually be happy to run with him as that kind of improvement is what we've been asking for and is a great base to move on into 2024 with.
You play your 100% best team against SF regardless. Pete knows the fans would hate him if he got cute in team selection for this game above almost all others. Because if we could somehow make things finally click in this week to get a win, get Geno playing well, the Eagles game takes on a whole new look as does the rest of the season, with the playoffs right back in our hands and control.
I belive it is solely related to an actual injury worry. We saw how the last game vs the 49ers with a less than 100% Geno was not good. Get ahead of the narrative from Pete so the fans, media, and team, know there is a chance Lock maybe thrown in a very deep end. Otherwise those very uncomfortable questions will be coming hard and fast at Pete, including rapidly rising demands for some very serious changes in the off-season such as the exit of Pete Caroll.
There is, I think, only one source of demand for his exit of any consequence. She and the fan base might not share all that many objectives.
QB aside, what is sad is the continuing lax middle zone Defense - That we get shredded at every week with no adjustments!
Your article on Geno’s contract is the one that nails it, Ken.
The Seahawks now need help to make the playoffs and Geno has no chance at hitting his incentives.
So, a manufactured reason to start Lock is right on the money.
I could see it happening as if Smith has a groin pull. I suspect they do want to see what lock can do as I don’t believe they can afford to keep Smith next season under his current deal. They have invested so much in mediocre players with contracts that are going to be hard to get out of with a significant cap hit.
Well now we have the conundrum I feared. It seems to me that Pete is finally making ‘noise’ about starting Lock. Is it coz Geno’s injury is that bad, or is it coz the season’s on the line and Geno just ain’t it?
The conundrum now is that if Lock turns out even worse than Geno, the seasons definitely at its end. If he actually plays well, it might be too late coz it can take a couple of games to get going. It’ll be unfair on Lock to put him in that position. Particularly as we now need to win pretty much from here on, and his first opportunity comes against a team that has owned us for quite some time. It’s a lot of pressure and I hope he’s up for the task.
I think it’s all now too little too late.
PC and JS are always looking at next year and the year after. This move will determine who grooms our next QB and when it starts, which then dictates the new budget and how to achieve their aims and fill the needs. It is how we've remained competitive year in/year out. Athletes at the NFL level have proven to revel in pressure situations. They live for it. They gargle with it, spit it out and ask for more. Being shy or scared on the field will get you gone, fast. Coaches want to see grim determined focus. Russ has it in spades, now he has learned how the anger element was screwing him up. It's the "other level" few can attain. As we perfect this Art of Football, the League is correct in trying to incorporate the martial arts insistence on doing no permanent damage, as men in this state can be deadly. I don't like it but can understand the why of it. Maybe it's a clue to why our Hawks find the bulk of calls weighted against them.
The team that has owned us for quite some is also the NFC SB fave playing at home. This would be the NFL equivalent of throwing Lock to the wolves.
"The conundrum now is that if Lock turns out even worse than Geno, the seasons definitely at its end. If he actually plays well, it might be too late coz it can take a couple of games to get going."
This has been the risk for several weeks now. _Maybe_ a case could have been made for rolling the dice during the weak part of the schedule, but if they came up snake eyes then the gantlet part of the schedule would have been even more painful & the season even more severely toasted.
It was always a high risk season, just like last year.
I agree. But it would have been better to know earlier I reckon.
Geno has had some bad games, even in wins this year but one of them was not last week vs the Cowboys. He missed a couple of gimmes and tossed a bad INT, but it was his best or 2nd best game of the season, IMO. While I hate the thought of Lock starting against a team that's pretty much the old LOB to prove his case as a starter, we will see what he can do, should he be tasked with this. I gave us around a 10% chance of winning with Smith, so c'est la vie. And who knows? Maybe he has the performance of his life. I thought and said here all along that I thought the Eagles were the easiest (and I use that term loosely) of this so-called gauntlet, and we gave a decent showing against the Cowboys. Maybe either of these guys I consider worthy backups but not starters can put on a show! It's happened before. In more than a few games against the Seahawks!
As of early this week, I showed Dallas having a mean OPFOR win rate of 40.5%...but a MEDIAN OPFOR rate of only 33.3%, suggesting that their defensive statistics might over-state their case for being "all that". The RYO eigenvector model (previously commented on) suggested (FWIW, IMHO, EIEIO) they're in the bottom third of the league, which (because of how it propagates scoring instead of won/loss record) is consistent with the median number.
I'm still really, really looking forward to see the 'boys play with their Eagle friends (RYO ranked even lower!) just to see how wrong I can be.
That model has me more than a little bit apprehensive about Sunday's game in San Francisco. I might end up being sorry I ever made that thing.
Dallas has a good defense and probably a deeper defensive line but overall I think San Francisco is a better team I think if Smith plays he has limited mobility wise it would be brutal
Geno Smith had an mvp type performance. He out played in some regards an MVP top candidate. He led his offense to the 9th best offensive output of the year! (to that point)
He threw an interception on an incredible play from a db, a route his wr didn’t win, and he missed it inside. Look at who the top turnovers makers are at QB in the league. Turnovers hurt but aggressive turnovers should be expected and needed to play aggressive football to win.
Geno received a play called on the final play that let Micah parsons attack him unblocked with the only option a third string RB running across the formation to the flat. That is now Geno's fault?
Do we want Geno to call the plays also? Or take Shane’s calls and say no I’m not doing it?
Let’s get some fair QB analysis here ... c'mon man.
I am a lock fan but losing Geno after he played such an incredible game is such a bummer. Did he and Shane turn the corner and learn to get the ball out fast (yes that leads to int sometimes)?
I think Geno will still start because the dude is tough.
I will also be behind lock 💯 if he does go because I also think he has a great chance to be good. Also, it just increases variance of the game but may increase win chances as new QBs often have a spike at the start before the NFL catches onto their tendencies.
Go hawks
We saw the INT differently. A sideline throw to the inside shoulder is not a good pass. Geno had protection, too.
https://youtu.be/oYIJ_drKDFs?si=GZPillaAo7SAjKtY
We see it the same way. I may not have said it clearly. It was thrown inside. But I would add, it was a great play by DB and the WR didn’t win on the route (or do any favors to protect QB).
I would also add, not all ints are the same. Getting the ball out quick means playing with anticipation. I would rather have Geno say, “boom, I got my guy Tyler one on one, I’m gonna trust him to win therefore I throw now before I know for sure”. Sometimes ints happen. But better that way than holding the ball.
And you can see this by Int %. Who leads the league in Ints? Who is behind Geno in Int %?
Guys like Josh Allen, Pat Mahomes, Tua, Hurts etc.
Why? Because Ints actually aren’t a bigger deal than moving the football and to move the football effectively the ball will be in harms way at times.
You take the bad with the good. But don’t play scared and hold the ball.
"He threw an interception on an incredible play from a db, a route his wr didn’t win, and he missed it inside."
Lockett certainly didn't win his route by any definition of the term, and he's been doing that at important moments this entire year. I hope this is because he's banged up. Otherwise, as much as I like the guy ...he's probably close to popped.
"Geno received a play called on the final play that let Micah parsons attack him unblocked with the only option a third string RB running across the formation to the flat."
Seriously, why do you run your 3rd/4th string RB in DJ Dallas for that play? It just gave me flashbacks of the SB play that shall not be mentioned. Noah Fant or even "friggin' Bobo" would have been FINE for that play call, but Dallas?!? WTF are you thinking, asking him to rub Micah Parsons, then get out and catch a pass in the flat and turn upfield and gain yardage against the 49ers? It was THAT play that made me think I won't be sad if we change OC's this offseason. But I feel bad for Waldron. He was brought in to fix an aging -or at least slowing Russ. "How about we get some great draft picks and you work with Geno and Drew for a while?" -John Schneider probably. But he's driven me crazy abandoning the run back when we had our good ones healthy, our TEs aren't involved enough, etc.. I just feel like there's too much talent to ever suck. And we often have.
Agreed!
1) I think we are witnessing the baton being passed from Lockett to JSN. There is no shame for Tyler as he had an incredible career.
2) agree with everything you said about the last play. It is so frustrating that that is the play. It epitomizes either it works or doesn’t - no plan B.
I’d also say that I was really happy with Shane through the first three quarters. We saw TE chipping again. We saw quick throws. We actually saw the TEs catch some passes! He should be celebrated for that ... but man what a disaster of a final play call and final drive (run for the first down!).
Good comment chuck!
I've been watching our past games to torture myself for no good reason and had 2 big thoughts. #1 was, remember how hopeful we all were when we were 5-2, and barely lost to the Bengals, who are totally a good team? And coming in at second place was the last game I watched where we got stomped by the Ravens. Hard to believe in games like vs Giants that we were an NFL team that could get our shit kicked in by the league's best when they're healthy and playing their best. But we are. We don't have enough asskickers on our team. Pete knows it. John knows it. And why does "hashtag FIRE PETE" go around Twixxer these days and not #firejohn? The Russ trade was awesome, the last couple drafts are looking promising and with one surefire star (Spoon), and a 90%er (JSN). But good lord how long has it been since we had those drafts of old where all these talented picks took jobs?
I don't know, but in my opinion drafts are maybe 1% of the problem. A lot more maybe theoverblown veteran contracts for players who do not contribute that much. At least some of the free agents are working this time.
The asskickers part may be the biggest reason.
But as often in sports, I think if the Hawks had maybe 6 plays the whole season that went the other way they could be 9-3. Reasons were different for each play. And we would have to completely dissect every play to know who has to be blamed for anything and who not.
At least we could watch an mostly exciting squad with young key players, so there could be worse times being a fan.
I love your enthusiasm for Geno, Mike McD. Yes, he did have a good game. But 1 game doesn’t make a season - and look where our season’s at. High chance of no post season. A lot of that is on Geno’s so-so season.
I think it’s looooong overdue for Lock to get a chance. And a chance to me means at least a couple of games, as it can take a couple to get a feel for the atmosphere of it all.
My comment is in response to this paragraph from Joe not the season:
"However, he went just 23-of-41 (second-worst comp% of the season), threw a bad interception to DaRon Bland, had some Ankiel-ish off-target attempts that should have been slam dunks, and didn’t see what he needed to see pre-snap on the team’s final offensive play. Without blaming Geno for the loss, did he earn that fifth shot against the 49ers?"
How in the world do you have an MVP level performance and there is a question whether or not he "earn(ed) that fifth shot against the 49ers?"
Yeah, I understood that. But your overall post and season-long arguments have been very pro Geno. My point is that it’s time to try something else coz Geno isn’t happening for us.
As I stated, Geno’s last game was good. But it was the exception to his season’s performances. I thought SSJ’s points were relevant (yes, I know no game can ever be perfect).
I’m generally conservative with my outlook, but in my opinion, Enough’s enough.
I think part of the reasons I highlight Genos strengths is to:
A) offset Joe who is super negative on QBs. QB position is extremely difficult and organizations get stuck looking and hoping for a savior. I’d rather have a good team
B) to that point. To me the biggest issue is offensive line not QB. By blaming the QB I think it is deflecting the true issues which is O-line
However I was excited last game because it looked like Shane and Geno finally figured it out and said, ya know what my line isn’t very good. Let’s get the ball out quick. And bang: top offense emerged.
Lastly, I am also a fan of lock. I am very different from most people. It’s not Lock vs Geno to me. I think Lock will be good or at least has a good shot at being good.
If he ends up getting the start, I will be slightly bummed for Geno, but very excited to see what Lock can do. And I think he will do pretty good.
Go hawks
This will be good for Geno. I expect Lock will be playing Light's-Out Football. No sliding until a first down is secure, if at all. When the rest of the crew joins in and lights it up, we'll see some true football played, irregardless of pissy officials. All bets are off. If and when Geno is needed, it will be a whole new game and attitude he returns with. We demanded competition and shall see Pete Carrol's definition of it.
Go Hawks.
I think I would've agreed with you about "good for Geno" if it weren't coming off such a good game.
Last game was extremely exciting. I think you saw the potential of the Hawks offense show through. Quick throws. I think the identity will be DK slants. JSN taking over the torch from Lockett etc.
The Hawks beat the Niners in the last two quarters of the last game and that includes a botched call from the officials.
I know I am in the minority (and I already have bet it) but I had the Hawks winning this game. Without Geno I still think they can, but the variance goes way up.
Haha. Trigger warning.
From a 49er's perspective, who do they prepare for? Pete may field 4 or 5 guys nobody has seen, all of whom have butt-kicking resumes. Does this guy bolt left or right? Which way will this runner juke? What do we know about Lock's habits? How deep can he throw? How is he over the middle? What can we realistically expect from the Defense? The Offense? What's our plan? Tick Tock...2 days... And none of this considers a burning desire among premier athletes to go out and get some of their Street Cred back. While our Hawks no longer control our Playoff picture, we can sure as hell make the list of dangerous teams to play for those who think they have a lock on it. I'm a big believer that a Spoiler can take it all.
It’s been clear to me that if Lock starts, it wouldn’t be because Geno was benched. Lock’s start would be due to an injury. How serious would the injury be? That, we will never know. But Geno will not lose face with a flat out benching under Pete.
Is Pete this clever? Could this have been planned? Yeah. I think so.
Strike "clever". Insert "ruthless".