I heard chants for 49ers player names whenever they made a play. There were that many 49ers fans there. And from the broadcast, the team and coaches just had horrible body language. Say what you will about guys like Pete and Russ, but they always stayed upbeat and kept morale high during tough stretches.
I completely agree. There's SO MUCH MORE to being a great player than being able to throw a ball. The comradery doesn't appear to be there anymore, and that was a big part of what made the Seahawks stand out. No longer do announcers refer to the Hawks at every single game in the league no matter who the two teams are.
Not proud that I had 3 typos tonight. Sorry, was hurrying to get to 9 PM, but that's no excuse! I also should have given Shenault credit for the KO TD. He for sure is the only reason the game became close in the second half.
Lose to the Lions in Detroit with half the D not playing? Meh.
Lose to the Giants at home with the team getting healthier? Not good… but maybe the team was caught looking ahead to the Niners.
Gettting spanked AGAIN by the Niners at home AGAIN with abysmal D AGAIN and a QB not playing above replacement level? Very very BAD!
I don’t think it is too soon now to say that it is time to think about 2025. Play all the rookies and see what they’ve got. Play Howell (people criticizing Howell were saying it would be him putting up a stat line like Geno’s tonight, so how could he be worse?).
The team looks disorganized and disinterested. Time to shake it up.
Again this week o pretty much agree with everything you say Doug.
Some add ons
Who the hell is teaching the D how to tackle. Certainly not Kam.
What is a pass rush?
Run game. High school kids could have given us as many rush yards.
Geno is regressing every week. (ok he did play pretty good in Detroit). Tonight he ensured no extension and BIG salary will be coming his way from the seahawks.
Sad for all us fans that yelled our guts out trying to help a team that can't help itself.
Yes there is a universe where a loss vs the Niners would not have felt like a season killer. If they had led at any point and maybe lost on a missed FG at the end… but this was a fail in all three phases of the game (despite the ST TD the fumble negated that pretty much).
I am harder on Geno because there are so many weapons for the Seahawks on that side of the ball. Geno had enough time to make plays. Poor decisions and poor passes —including the INTs—dug a hole too big to overcome.
Agreed, Geno is anti-clutch and always has been! He is pathetic when those big lights come on in primetime. How many 1st down did we miss yesterday because he kept force feeding DK or air mailing throws to receivers 5 feet away?
Geno leads the league in Game Winning Drives. Over the last couple years. He had one of the best games at the QB position in primetime against the Lions and the Cowboys last year.
I agree with KR in that he was bad vs. SF. However, I disagree with the "big lights in primetime" part. As pointed out by, McD, he has led the league in comebacks the previous 2 years, even if he had those 1-2 "oof" moments in some games. He has been good this year, but not vs. SF, and not good enough to complete the comebacks this year, yet.
They are still "revitalizing", and will be for the next year or two, players and coaches.
About the only thing I can say is that sometimes you have to lose both badly and enough times before you finally sober up and figure out what it takes to win.
Lately I have been wondering why Seattle’s offense has so much trouble getting going. Is it a bad scheme/plan to start the game? Miscommunication among players? Are we just bad at run blocking so we become too one dimensional? Something else? Probably a combination of factors.
I’m hoping there are improvements along the way this year on offense and defense. There are plays and series that give me hope, but too many costly mistakes that give the other team easy chances to get ahead.
You know what, I'm going to come out and say something that a lot of people are probably going to disagree with.
I feel like the defense actually played a pretty decent game overall. Obviously, there were 3 big plays that they would have to like back: the big run on the first drive, the Deebo TD, and obviously the killer run on the last drive. However, aside from those, the defense was solid; they didn't give up the huge chunks through the air that we've been used to seeing, they didn't bleed yards on screens and dumpoffs that the 49ers have taken advantage of in the past and that the Giants shredded them on Sunday, and 10 of their points given up were after the offense/ST put them in horrible situations due to the fumble and second int.
Is there a lot of room for improvement? Obviously. The offense needs to really figure out how to get in a rhythm on the 2nd and 3rd drives of games before they fall into too deep of a hole. The returners on special teams still consistently make questionable decisions on whether to return the ball or not (aside from the spectacular TD return by Shenault). But the fact that the game was CLOSE, in the 4th quarter, is already a massive improvement from previous seasons.
We expected this year would be a rebuild and that they would start off slow with first-time OC, Head Coach/DC (and to a lesser extent ST coordinator). 3-3 isn't horrible, realistically before the season I think the prediction after 6 games would've been around 3-3 anyways (losses to dolphins, lions and 49ers). Let's take a step back, trust the process and hope macdonald and grubb can sort the mistakes out in the mini-bye, as well as get some key guys back like Byron Murphy.
Side notes:
1. I wish they could just bench dremont jones, I swear I've only seen him misplay against the run and he hasn't provided much pass rush either. Unfortunately with nwosu on IR they probably need to keep him in the rotation so mafe and hall don't get overworked.
2. Similarly, I don't think Jonathan Hankins is a guy you want out there consistently unless it's to give the other DTs a play or two to catch their breath. Getting Byron Murphy back will be huge for the D-line.
3. Cmon DK, 3 receptions on 11 targets is horrible and a lot of the incompletions were very catchable balls too. While he has good receiving stats overall this year, a lot of those have been on plays where he's simply been wide open. It really looks like that he's really not very good at contested catches unless he's using his big frame over the middle to shield the ball against incoming defenders (and then walk away unscathed while they lie on the ground from the impact of their own hit).
4. It's kind of ironic that the 49ers backup kicker got banged up while making a tackle on ST after Jake Moody got injured while making a tackle on ST last week, maybe we will win the rematch because their entire roster will be on IR.
The upcoming stretch will really tell us where we stand, 3-3 isn't above or below preseason expectations at this point so it's up to Macdonald and Grubb to make the adjustments and unlock the full potential of the roster. Go Hawks!
“Other than that Mrs. Lincoln how did you enjoy the play?” 😂
But I don’t completely disagree. The three turnovers would have doomed Seattle even with better play on the D side. But tonight exposed the inadequacy at LB particularly and in MMs scheme that is a killer. The D was better getting off the field on 3rd down tonight. But the explosive plays just can’t happen on the regular either.
Yea, we also forget that the ravens defense was good but didn't really take off under MM until they got Roquan Smith who was the true do-it-all LB that anchored the scheme. Now if only we had prime Bobby Wagner in the heart of the defense...
This team has a really good shot at 3-14. What are their most winnable games?
1. Next week @ Falcons - Falcons have played decent and this team has shown no signs of getting its shit together at all this season, let alone in a week.
2. @ Jets - Jets are a complete mess, so this is their best chance at a win, even though it's on the road and is a lock for 10 AM ET
3. vs. Arizona - And the Cardinals are no pushover right now.
They won't win in the Arizona House of Horrors (for the Seahawks anyway). They traditionally do terrible against the Rams. Rest of the games - hosting the Bills, Packers and Vikings, and at Chicago late in the year when Caleb Williams is likely to have his shit together.
Let it happen. Get a top 3 pick and move on to next year. This year is done.
I do get a notification on my phone, but if I don't acknowledge it fast enough then the home page tab is where I go. I think Joe is working on a way to fix this. Substack has been challenging for me until I make the same mistake several times and finally find my way.
What the last 3 games have shown is that the first three games were a mirage. Again, it's hard (for me at least) to blame Grubb because our OL cannot run block. Seriously. Just can't do it against a decent team. Walker is plenty good enough to thrive, or better, with a decent line blocking for him. Geno's post-game comments are getting saltier and saltier. But he knows he's been part of the problem, at least against the Giants and now the 9rs...and by now it looks like DK is just going to be an eternal tease...so we gotta work on getting JSN fully involved, from start to finish. As to the D, Coach Mac demonstrated before he got here that he can take talent and make a great defense. Not sure what his challenge is now, but I guess I have more hope for the future on that score...even though the numbers--in yards, points, missed tackles, lack of turnovers, number of first down conversions, time of possession, and on and on--are pretty damn poor.
It's not time to give up on the Hawks. The season can still be salvageable if the team does give up on themselves. If they do then some poor coaching may be the blame.
Leadership goes beyond the coaches. There are team captains who are right there in the huddle. The comradery the Hawks used to enjoy seems to be losing steam.
I am no football genius, but I am a paying member of SSJ. So I am going talk like one for a moment. What I saw tonight was Geno wanting to win this game. With the exception of Fant who had a just fine day, the receivers were dropping passes that hit their hands. Geno is the best value in the NFL. (Okay that is obviously Mr. Irrelevant until his rookie contract expires.) Anytime you have anti Geno thoughts please remember how many other good players his salary pays for. (SSJ if you wanted to actually calculate that or guess at it. My argument woulda sounded legit. )
I am trying to understand what you see as "anti Geno" - his good value on the books would probably be something to cheer about if we had something to cheer about on the field. It changes from game to game and he gets accolades when he plays well. So far, there's been one game that gave me hope for the season. I trust there will be more.
I didn’t get to watch much at work, so that is my positive take from this game. Niners still own us and I see no chance this year for that to change. Defense has no swagger or understanding of angles. Spoon tried to get everyone on board but it didn’t work yet. Too many turnovers, penalties at the worst possible times and our star receiver who never seems to be able to make a contested catch in crunch time or a QB to take the team on his back and master the position. I’m ready for next year’s new hope as I’ve pretty much lost it this year. If Mac doesn’t get a better focused team he will be seen as Pete II
If DK costs $35M a year, as Joe has sometimes suggested, (I think it will be closer to $30-$32) ... What can that get you at the guard/tackle position?
It is a good debate on where to allocate resources. Would you rather have Dk or two good guards?
I have only ever written that DK would want to make $32 million like AJ Brown. I don't want people to confuse what you say for truth since they might assume you are anti-Joe.
“If DK is hoping to have a career-year (and he’s tracking that way) then he’s probably not going to happy just topping A.J. Brown’s deal ($32m AAV) by just $100k. He’s probably going to ask for more like $35 million.”
This is from October 3rd; should the Seahawks extend anyone article.
3-3, but feels like 1-5. To be fair, there were no new issues last night, just repeats. Stuttering offence and a defence that would let someone with a broken leg rush for 100 yards against them.
Not all doom and gloom because honestly this was expected. I had hoped by Week 6 we'd be close to the 49ers than this. I'll stick by the new staff and really assessment comes in Week 18 at the end of the year. I don't think we're any worse than last year under PC, we're just not really looking that much better either.
Hopefully the Kraken can have a good year to lift the mood of Seattle sports.
I had just finished listening to two East Coast scouts talk about how solid, how good a QB the Seahawks had in Geno Smith. I don't think they're wrong. I thought the opening run plays were not clever and entirely predictable; all they proved was we can't run block. DK dropped a first down pass early, and then we started giving the ball away.
OK.
Deep breath.
Three games in eleven games. It didn't go well. New HC, new coordinators. This is where Leslie Frazier take them all out for a midnight breakfast and talks them off the ledge. This is where the coaches and the players pull themselves together. Units don't cohere when things are good and seem easy. They cohere (or don't) when shit gets real.
Some of this is up to the players.
It cannot be easy to install new systems with a two-game preseason, followed by major injuries. And this year was always going to be a sorting out of who can and who can't, it just might be an uglier sorting than we thought.
IF we win the next game, this trio will look less concerning. If we don't...I keep going back to how fiercely the Lions played that season they won, what? two games? Especially at the end of the year. Those guys BELIEVED. And they were right. That's what I want for us.
All the red jerseys even in the front rows :(((((🤮
I heard chants for 49ers player names whenever they made a play. There were that many 49ers fans there. And from the broadcast, the team and coaches just had horrible body language. Say what you will about guys like Pete and Russ, but they always stayed upbeat and kept morale high during tough stretches.
I completely agree. There's SO MUCH MORE to being a great player than being able to throw a ball. The comradery doesn't appear to be there anymore, and that was a big part of what made the Seahawks stand out. No longer do announcers refer to the Hawks at every single game in the league no matter who the two teams are.
Not proud that I had 3 typos tonight. Sorry, was hurrying to get to 9 PM, but that's no excuse! I also should have given Shenault credit for the KO TD. He for sure is the only reason the game became close in the second half.
Lose to the Lions in Detroit with half the D not playing? Meh.
Lose to the Giants at home with the team getting healthier? Not good… but maybe the team was caught looking ahead to the Niners.
Gettting spanked AGAIN by the Niners at home AGAIN with abysmal D AGAIN and a QB not playing above replacement level? Very very BAD!
I don’t think it is too soon now to say that it is time to think about 2025. Play all the rookies and see what they’ve got. Play Howell (people criticizing Howell were saying it would be him putting up a stat line like Geno’s tonight, so how could he be worse?).
The team looks disorganized and disinterested. Time to shake it up.
Again this week o pretty much agree with everything you say Doug.
Some add ons
Who the hell is teaching the D how to tackle. Certainly not Kam.
What is a pass rush?
Run game. High school kids could have given us as many rush yards.
Geno is regressing every week. (ok he did play pretty good in Detroit). Tonight he ensured no extension and BIG salary will be coming his way from the seahawks.
Sad for all us fans that yelled our guts out trying to help a team that can't help itself.
Yes there is a universe where a loss vs the Niners would not have felt like a season killer. If they had led at any point and maybe lost on a missed FG at the end… but this was a fail in all three phases of the game (despite the ST TD the fumble negated that pretty much).
I am harder on Geno because there are so many weapons for the Seahawks on that side of the ball. Geno had enough time to make plays. Poor decisions and poor passes —including the INTs—dug a hole too big to overcome.
Agreed, Geno is anti-clutch and always has been! He is pathetic when those big lights come on in primetime. How many 1st down did we miss yesterday because he kept force feeding DK or air mailing throws to receivers 5 feet away?
Geno leads the league in Game Winning Drives. Over the last couple years. He had one of the best games at the QB position in primetime against the Lions and the Cowboys last year.
I think I counted 2 missed throws on third down.
I agree with KR in that he was bad vs. SF. However, I disagree with the "big lights in primetime" part. As pointed out by, McD, he has led the league in comebacks the previous 2 years, even if he had those 1-2 "oof" moments in some games. He has been good this year, but not vs. SF, and not good enough to complete the comebacks this year, yet.
They are still "revitalizing", and will be for the next year or two, players and coaches.
Well said.
About the only thing I can say is that sometimes you have to lose both badly and enough times before you finally sober up and figure out what it takes to win.
Lately I have been wondering why Seattle’s offense has so much trouble getting going. Is it a bad scheme/plan to start the game? Miscommunication among players? Are we just bad at run blocking so we become too one dimensional? Something else? Probably a combination of factors.
I’m hoping there are improvements along the way this year on offense and defense. There are plays and series that give me hope, but too many costly mistakes that give the other team easy chances to get ahead.
You know what, I'm going to come out and say something that a lot of people are probably going to disagree with.
I feel like the defense actually played a pretty decent game overall. Obviously, there were 3 big plays that they would have to like back: the big run on the first drive, the Deebo TD, and obviously the killer run on the last drive. However, aside from those, the defense was solid; they didn't give up the huge chunks through the air that we've been used to seeing, they didn't bleed yards on screens and dumpoffs that the 49ers have taken advantage of in the past and that the Giants shredded them on Sunday, and 10 of their points given up were after the offense/ST put them in horrible situations due to the fumble and second int.
Is there a lot of room for improvement? Obviously. The offense needs to really figure out how to get in a rhythm on the 2nd and 3rd drives of games before they fall into too deep of a hole. The returners on special teams still consistently make questionable decisions on whether to return the ball or not (aside from the spectacular TD return by Shenault). But the fact that the game was CLOSE, in the 4th quarter, is already a massive improvement from previous seasons.
We expected this year would be a rebuild and that they would start off slow with first-time OC, Head Coach/DC (and to a lesser extent ST coordinator). 3-3 isn't horrible, realistically before the season I think the prediction after 6 games would've been around 3-3 anyways (losses to dolphins, lions and 49ers). Let's take a step back, trust the process and hope macdonald and grubb can sort the mistakes out in the mini-bye, as well as get some key guys back like Byron Murphy.
Side notes:
1. I wish they could just bench dremont jones, I swear I've only seen him misplay against the run and he hasn't provided much pass rush either. Unfortunately with nwosu on IR they probably need to keep him in the rotation so mafe and hall don't get overworked.
2. Similarly, I don't think Jonathan Hankins is a guy you want out there consistently unless it's to give the other DTs a play or two to catch their breath. Getting Byron Murphy back will be huge for the D-line.
3. Cmon DK, 3 receptions on 11 targets is horrible and a lot of the incompletions were very catchable balls too. While he has good receiving stats overall this year, a lot of those have been on plays where he's simply been wide open. It really looks like that he's really not very good at contested catches unless he's using his big frame over the middle to shield the ball against incoming defenders (and then walk away unscathed while they lie on the ground from the impact of their own hit).
4. It's kind of ironic that the 49ers backup kicker got banged up while making a tackle on ST after Jake Moody got injured while making a tackle on ST last week, maybe we will win the rematch because their entire roster will be on IR.
The upcoming stretch will really tell us where we stand, 3-3 isn't above or below preseason expectations at this point so it's up to Macdonald and Grubb to make the adjustments and unlock the full potential of the roster. Go Hawks!
“Other than that Mrs. Lincoln how did you enjoy the play?” 😂
But I don’t completely disagree. The three turnovers would have doomed Seattle even with better play on the D side. But tonight exposed the inadequacy at LB particularly and in MMs scheme that is a killer. The D was better getting off the field on 3rd down tonight. But the explosive plays just can’t happen on the regular either.
Yea, we also forget that the ravens defense was good but didn't really take off under MM until they got Roquan Smith who was the true do-it-all LB that anchored the scheme. Now if only we had prime Bobby Wagner in the heart of the defense...
This team has a really good shot at 3-14. What are their most winnable games?
1. Next week @ Falcons - Falcons have played decent and this team has shown no signs of getting its shit together at all this season, let alone in a week.
2. @ Jets - Jets are a complete mess, so this is their best chance at a win, even though it's on the road and is a lock for 10 AM ET
3. vs. Arizona - And the Cardinals are no pushover right now.
They won't win in the Arizona House of Horrors (for the Seahawks anyway). They traditionally do terrible against the Rams. Rest of the games - hosting the Bills, Packers and Vikings, and at Chicago late in the year when Caleb Williams is likely to have his shit together.
Let it happen. Get a top 3 pick and move on to next year. This year is done.
Same. At 3-0 I thought the Vegas projection of 7.5 wins was toast but now anyone holding the under likely has a winning ticket.
I tried to find in game feed and would’ve loved to participate , but couldn’t
Hey Mike if you go to the SSJ home page there is a chat tab. Click on that and scroll to th game chat and you are IN.
I do get a notification on my phone, but if I don't acknowledge it fast enough then the home page tab is where I go. I think Joe is working on a way to fix this. Substack has been challenging for me until I make the same mistake several times and finally find my way.
What the last 3 games have shown is that the first three games were a mirage. Again, it's hard (for me at least) to blame Grubb because our OL cannot run block. Seriously. Just can't do it against a decent team. Walker is plenty good enough to thrive, or better, with a decent line blocking for him. Geno's post-game comments are getting saltier and saltier. But he knows he's been part of the problem, at least against the Giants and now the 9rs...and by now it looks like DK is just going to be an eternal tease...so we gotta work on getting JSN fully involved, from start to finish. As to the D, Coach Mac demonstrated before he got here that he can take talent and make a great defense. Not sure what his challenge is now, but I guess I have more hope for the future on that score...even though the numbers--in yards, points, missed tackles, lack of turnovers, number of first down conversions, time of possession, and on and on--are pretty damn poor.
It's not time to give up on the Hawks. The season can still be salvageable if the team does give up on themselves. If they do then some poor coaching may be the blame.
Leadership goes beyond the coaches. There are team captains who are right there in the huddle. The comradery the Hawks used to enjoy seems to be losing steam.
I am no football genius, but I am a paying member of SSJ. So I am going talk like one for a moment. What I saw tonight was Geno wanting to win this game. With the exception of Fant who had a just fine day, the receivers were dropping passes that hit their hands. Geno is the best value in the NFL. (Okay that is obviously Mr. Irrelevant until his rookie contract expires.) Anytime you have anti Geno thoughts please remember how many other good players his salary pays for. (SSJ if you wanted to actually calculate that or guess at it. My argument woulda sounded legit. )
I am trying to understand what you see as "anti Geno" - his good value on the books would probably be something to cheer about if we had something to cheer about on the field. It changes from game to game and he gets accolades when he plays well. So far, there's been one game that gave me hope for the season. I trust there will be more.
Bingo.
Spot on. I just rewatched the first half and counted I think 3 poor or bad plays from Geno.
QBs are just a proxy for how the team is playing not how he is playing himself.
Just in case you were wondering who wrote the article titled, "Geno Smith could sit out the entire year and still be a bargain", it was me:
https://www.seasidejoe.com/p/geno-smith-seahawks-contract-salary-cap-2023
I didn’t get to watch much at work, so that is my positive take from this game. Niners still own us and I see no chance this year for that to change. Defense has no swagger or understanding of angles. Spoon tried to get everyone on board but it didn’t work yet. Too many turnovers, penalties at the worst possible times and our star receiver who never seems to be able to make a contested catch in crunch time or a QB to take the team on his back and master the position. I’m ready for next year’s new hope as I’ve pretty much lost it this year. If Mac doesn’t get a better focused team he will be seen as Pete II
FYI :
Rush yards for the 49ers against the Seahawks during their 6-0 run. We're going from Sept. 2022 to tonight:
189
170
181
169
173
228
Seahawks rushing yards:
36
70
104
88
70
52
We need to get rid of DK, Dremont, Fant contracts and Beef up our line. Absolute travesty. Difficult to watch.
If DK costs $35M a year, as Joe has sometimes suggested, (I think it will be closer to $30-$32) ... What can that get you at the guard/tackle position?
It is a good debate on where to allocate resources. Would you rather have Dk or two good guards?
2 great guards... then draft a WR to go with JSN, Bobo, and others. $35 million will pay for a great guard and a good one, at least.
What you said.
I have only ever written that DK would want to make $32 million like AJ Brown. I don't want people to confuse what you say for truth since they might assume you are anti-Joe.
https://www.seasidejoe.com/p/seahawks-dk-metcalf-trade-rumors-contract
“If DK is hoping to have a career-year (and he’s tracking that way) then he’s probably not going to happy just topping A.J. Brown’s deal ($32m AAV) by just $100k. He’s probably going to ask for more like $35 million.”
This is from October 3rd; should the Seahawks extend anyone article.
3-3, but feels like 1-5. To be fair, there were no new issues last night, just repeats. Stuttering offence and a defence that would let someone with a broken leg rush for 100 yards against them.
Not all doom and gloom because honestly this was expected. I had hoped by Week 6 we'd be close to the 49ers than this. I'll stick by the new staff and really assessment comes in Week 18 at the end of the year. I don't think we're any worse than last year under PC, we're just not really looking that much better either.
Hopefully the Kraken can have a good year to lift the mood of Seattle sports.
I had just finished listening to two East Coast scouts talk about how solid, how good a QB the Seahawks had in Geno Smith. I don't think they're wrong. I thought the opening run plays were not clever and entirely predictable; all they proved was we can't run block. DK dropped a first down pass early, and then we started giving the ball away.
OK.
Deep breath.
Three games in eleven games. It didn't go well. New HC, new coordinators. This is where Leslie Frazier take them all out for a midnight breakfast and talks them off the ledge. This is where the coaches and the players pull themselves together. Units don't cohere when things are good and seem easy. They cohere (or don't) when shit gets real.
Some of this is up to the players.
It cannot be easy to install new systems with a two-game preseason, followed by major injuries. And this year was always going to be a sorting out of who can and who can't, it just might be an uglier sorting than we thought.
IF we win the next game, this trio will look less concerning. If we don't...I keep going back to how fiercely the Lions played that season they won, what? two games? Especially at the end of the year. Those guys BELIEVED. And they were right. That's what I want for us.
The scouts are right. Geno is good.
QB is just a lightning rod for fans whenever their teams lose but has little to do with how the QB actually plays.
Thank you Doug